Conversion
“. . . to open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the authority of Satan to God; in order that they may receive forgiveness for sins, and an inheritance among those being sanctified by faith in Me.” Acts 26:18
To Turn – It’s quite common for Christians to speak of Paul’s conversion on the road to Damascus. Unfortunately, that’s imported theology. The Greek verb epistrepho is consistently used for the conversion of Gentiles, never for the conversion of Jews. Paul’s mission was to bring the Gentiles into the house of Israel through Yeshua. He explains that mission to Agrippa in this passage. He says Yeshua instructed him to open the eyes of the Gentiles and enable them to convert from a life dictated by the demands of Satan to a life under the benevolence of God. That mission statement could hardly be ascribed to the Jews. They were not under the authority of Satan. Jews did not convert to the God of Scriptures. They already believed in the one true God. What they needed to see was the truth about the Messiah Yeshua. But nowhere in the New Testament (the Ketuvim Netzarim – writing of those who follow the Nazarene Yeshua) is this ever called a conversion.
You will find the same Greek verb used in Acts 11:21 concerning the Gentiles in Antioch, in Acts 14:15 for the appeal to men in Lystra, in Acts 15:19 where James specifically refers to the Gentiles and in James 5:19 and 20 where it is applied to returning sinners. This Greek verb is the equivalent of the Hebrew shuv, the most important verb in the Tanakh for returning to the one true God of Israel. But in the Ketuvim Netzarim it is never applied to the house of Israel, even to those who are disobedient members of the house.
Almost all of us are converts. We came from Gentile backgrounds. We served false gods, perhaps not intentionally but certainly willingly. We chased the dreams the world offered. We subscribed to religions of man-made dogmas. We were far from the house of Israel. So, epistrepho applies to us. Somehow God touched us and brought us into the company of His people. We are converts. Unfortunately, in this age many ethnic Jews also need to be converted because in spite of their heritage, they are really Greek in the way they think and act. They are just as much citizens of the world as we were. But when Sha’ul wrote his letters and when Luke wrote his chronicle, there was a clear distinction between those who were faithful followers of God (Jews) and those who were outside the house of Jacob. Conversion meant becoming an adopted son or daughter of Israel’s God, not of some new religion called Christianity. Sha’ul was never a Christian. Neither were any of Yeshua’s closest disciples. They were all Jews who believed Yeshua was the promised Messiah.
Why is this so important? What difference does it matter now that Christianity is well-established as a religion that also worships the one true God? The reason it matters is simple: Sha’ul thinks, speaks, writes and preaches as a Messianic Jew. In fact, every author of the New Testament has the same worldview – Jewish. As soon as we start to treat the words of these men as if they were something other than the words of Messianic believing Jews, we misunderstand them. They do not share the worldview of the Greeks. They do not employ Scripture in their letters the way that Greek thinkers do. They do not have the same view of social responsibility, government, ethics, money, power, religion or the “church.” Their worldview comes from second Temple Judaism, massaged by rabbinic thinking. If we want to understand them, we must resist all attempts to “convert” them to a new religion. They never left Judaism. They just saw their Messiah come. Conversion is for us, the outsiders. A Gentile converts. A Jew just believes.
Topical Index: conversion, epistrepho, shuv, Judaism, worldview, Acts 26:18
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Agreed …. a Jew … like Sha’ul or other believers would never have “left” their religion to accept Mashiach Yeshua. No debates …. 🙂
However the matter of conversion may be a bit more complex. Skip could you please explain in what context transformation/conversion is being discussed in the following passages:
Matthew: 13:14 – 13:17 – (Mark 4:12) – (John 12:40)
Matthew: 18:1 – 18:3
Luke 22:32
I ask the question because conversion should not be viewed as being mutually exclusive of Spiritual Re-birth …. as Yeshua makes clear in John chapter 3 while revealing matters to Nicodemus.
I also do not believe that we can simply point to “conversion of a Jew” to mean “t’shuvah”.
So I know what the message is conveying today … and I do so much agree that there is no conversion to a “new religion” … a.k.a. Christianity from a Biblical perspective …. however I respectfully would contend that there is conversion …. for both Gentile and Jew …. as a result of Yeshua’s Glorification and gift of Ruach HaKodesh!
You are keeping me busy! LOL
Morning Drew,
Thanks for mentioning Mark.
Most of my life, if I wanted to know something about Jesus, I read Mark, for some reason.
He is a little bit like a President and CEO of a company; keeps it simple and clear.
For example, and I just love rereading this stuff:
Mar 4:11 And He was saying to them, “To you has been given the mystery of the kingdom of God, but those who are outside get everything in parables,
Mar 4:12 so that WHILE SEEING, THEY MAY SEE AND NOT PERCEIVE, AND WHILE HEARING, THEY MAY HEAR AND NOT UNDERSTAND, OTHERWISE THEY MIGHT RETURN AND BE FORGIVEN.”
Mar 4:13 And He *said to them, “Do you not understand this parable? How will you understand all the parables?
Mar 4:14 “The sower sows the word.
What is second Temple Judiasm?
Shalom Cindy … real short answer … after the fall of the kingdom of Judah and exile into Babylon …. Israel returned to the land and undertook the rebuilding of The Second Temple and all of their society. It is within this second temple period that Rabinnic culture (influenced by the exile itself) really took shape …. it is this cultural environment in which Yeshua, Sha’ul and all the Jews operated. It is this perspective that really needs to be understood to minimally grasp what was actually being transmitted from ELOHIM to His people!
Beyond this basic need of translation there is much debate surrounding how much this Rabinnic perspective needs to be generally applied …. and so forth. Oye Vey!
Perfect answer. Thanks. And by the way, Bob Gorelik can address this in detail in Jerusalem when you are there, Cyndee.
“Conversion meant becoming an adopted son or daughter of Israel’s God, not of some new religion called Christianity. Sha’ul was never a Christian. Neither were any of Yeshua’s closest disciples. They were all Jews who believed Yeshua was the promised Messiah.”
Skip, I am hearing you say we are converted to a ‘who’ (Yeshua) rather than a ‘what’ (Judaism/Christianity). So if Yeshua, Sha’ul and the disciples never called themselves Christians, what are we to call ourselves (is that even the right question)?
Sure, it’s the right question. You should read Peter Leithart, “Against Christianity,” which you can order on my Recommended Reading list from the web site (and help At God’s Table at the same time). Don’t worry. Peter is a true follower of Yeshua. He is not against being a Christian. He just points out that the institutionalized religion called Christianity is nothing like the biblical idea of being a follower of the Messiah. It’s a good read.
Yes, I am quite sure we are “converted” to a “who.” We follow a rabbi named Yeshua. We serve a God named YHWH. We join His people called Israel. This is the reason the early disciples were called followers of the Way, not “Christians.” In fact, if you really think about it, you can easily imagine how shocked Sha’ul and the others would be to see what Christianity has become.
Now, given 20 centuries of accumulated syncretism, it probably doesn’t matter too much if we say we are Christians today. Truthfully, I doubt that most people who think of themselves as Christians really have any clear idea of what that means. So, the label doesn’t matter too much since it covers just about anything you want within the scope of a religion. But between you and me, if we want to let the world know who we really are, then we are followers of Yeshua, the Son of the Most High God of Israel.
Please take a look at Peter’s book.
Thanks Skip! The reviews on this book are fascinating. Just ordered through your link. I will be meditating on your thought that “we are followers of Yeshua, the Son of the Most High God of Israel.”
I’m so blessed that most of the books recommended on this blog are available for check-out in the library where I work, which is at a Christian Academic University library. I have already four books at home in progress…and now I’m going upstairs to check-out Peter Leithart’s book…with gratefulness for this blesses opportunity. Thank you for sharing and recommended books.
Off the subject just a bit. Skip, you say that Sha’ul never waivered from the law and was a completely Torah observant Jew. But it appears that Sha’ul was stating in Galatians 5 and 6 that circumcision needed not to be observed, especially in Galatians 6:15. Could you or someone help me with this? I’m not asking simply to know. This issue seems to be hindering those I talk to about the Hebrew worldview and how obedience to Torah increases our usefulness to G-d. Some people are questioning that if Sha’ul basically said that if circumcision no longer mattered, then what other parts of Torah doesn’t matter. Thanks!
Jimmy
Mark 4:11 And He was saying to them, “To you has been given the mystery of the kingdom of God, but those who are outside get everything in parables…
Karl Marx “From each according to his abilities, to each acccording to his needs.”
Hi Jimmy,
First let me say that I’m no expert on Paul 🙂
But the way I see it, Paul is mad as hell, speaking to a group of male Gentiles, and as Freud pointed out a few years later, all males suffer from a deep “unconscious” fear of castration.
And while it is one thing to be circumcised as an infant, it would be another thing altogether to be circumcised at 40 years old.
For Paul, that would have been a very “hard sell.”
Paul’s primary issue is how to “bridge the gap” between Jews and Gentiles. No easy task.
Paul’s objective is to make the gentiles see how important it is to live in Christ and to be faithful to the Torah. A good idea.
But the fact of the matter is that Paul can’t have it all; at least not with these knuckle-heads.
As I recall, Paul is speaking to people whose culture allows prostitutes in their temples and does not even acknowledge the Jewish incest taboos.
So for Paul, in relative terms, circumcision is a non-issue. At the same time it is an important aspect of the Torah and therefore important to those who want to walk in the way,
my 2 cents 🙂
Not quite, but a good try. 🙂 See my comment to Jimmy. Also, take a look at John Gager, Reinventing Paul, where a good deal of this use of argument is explained. I don’t agree with all of Gager’s analysis as I think he subtly endorses a replacement theology and has a deficient epistemology, but his analysis of the disaster we have made of understanding Paul (actually of twisting Paul) is excellent.
I am trying to release a 23 hour lecture series of Galatians which really goes at this issue with circumcision. Hope to have it done in about 3 weeks, before the Israel trip. 🙂
Read more. Sha’ul goes right on to say that circumcision matters in every way. Then he complains that if it doesn’t matter, why is he being persecuted by these detractors. What is happening here is a style of argument that we aren’t very familiar with anymore. Sha’ul is using a kind of rhetorical argument where the author constructs a “straw man” as his opponent and then refutes the anticipated objections of this fictitious objector. That accounts for some of his supposed contradictions. He is giving you both sides of the argument, but he only really endorses one.
In addition, Sha’ul is making a distinction between circumcision as a MEANS OF SALVATION and circumcision as a DEMONSTRATION OF OBEDIENCE. He argues that circumcision means nothing if you think it will save you. That road leads to trying to keep the whole law in order to gain favor with God. That is legalism at its worst, leaving the poor individual under constant condemnation. In this regard, circumcision has no value.
But that doesn’t mean circumcision is worthless. It is the sign of the covenant, but the covenant comes BEFORE circumcision. So, circumcision doesn’t make the covenant. God does that before we do anything at all, but once God grants us grace, we demonstrate our willingness to obey Him and our gratefulness for His gift by following His instructions.
Think of this. If circumcision is the way to salvation, then no woman could ever be saved. That doesn’t make any sense at all. So, why would God command circumcision. For other reasons, of course.
Hi Jimmy,
More two cents and I hope this helps 🙂 These arguments have been made for centuries and frankly the issue of circumcision for Gentiles is not a matter of Torah observance at all. Sha’ul discusses circumcision in the context of a Gentile being a Gentile and a Jew being Jew. The distinction is important to the extent of promises, roles, prophetic fulfillment and a slew of factors. (Despite how difficult this is to grasp …. there are reasons and differences for Jew and Gentile in the plan of ELOHIM!)
At issue is the fact that a Gentile can be grafted into Israel without being physically integrated into the seed of Ya’akov. A Gentile can become a member of the Kingdom and does not have to undergo a transformation of the flesh since a true Jew is one that is circumcised of the heart!
Obviously this issue arose in the first century CE and much of Sha’ul’s teachings were in response to the Judaizers who sought to force circumcision upon the newly integrated Gentile believers. This ultimately led to the Jerusalem Council and the much debated Noachide regulations …. upon which Skip has elegantly commented upon numerous times.
Back to the issue of what is no longer necessary within Torah … in light of Yeshua (praise Him)!
Without getting bogged down into discussion of the mitzvot applicable to The Temple, Priests, etc (which mind you all remain applicable in “principle”) we really need only discuss the “sin sacrifice” which Yeshua perfected for all eternity.
Righteousness a.k.a. the Character of ELOHIM as reflected in Torah is of course valid … forever. Yeshua’s Glorification in fact presents us with the gift of Ruach HaKodesh and the embedding of Torah upon our hearts! What goes away is Torah by rote … Torah by traditional conventions … Torah as a means of self justification …. Torah as interpreted and applied in human perspectives.
Since Yeshua HaMashiach, Torah observance and application is now a function of Spiritual indwelling enabling His children to live beyond the limitations of the old creation and embracing the unlimited power of His Kingdom through restoration with the source of all eternity!
Torah matters … because all that matters is ELOHIM and Torah reflects His character! As our Spirit transforms …. we submit to His character and apply It outward to this dying creation; we glorify Him by showing the world what He is all about! Love, Mercy, Kindness, Righteousness and so forth.
It is all about Yeshua …. and His Kingdom is all about His character … we as His subjects should reflect nothing but the same just as Yeshua reflected nothing but The Father!
He is awesome and so are His ways!
Guys,
I guess what I am searching for is a little application to all this Hebrew “thought.” I have listened to Skip and read his work for 6 years and still am confused as to what we are supossed to be “doing” with all of this. What part of Torah do we follow, not just love, mercy, kindness, etc. That’s not specific and lends itself to one’s own interpretation.
Thanks,
Jimmy
Hi Jimmy,
I guess I was addressing one part of your question: “what other parts of Torah do not matter?”
And my point was that it all “matters;” but what to do with it is somewhat problematic sometimes.
For the most part, I try to understand Skip’s message, then I try to align myself with it and act accordingly.
In addition to reading the Bible, I read a lot of related material, and on Saturdays I listen to Rabbi Gorelik at the following URL:
http://www.seekandyouwillfind.ca/Seek_and_you_will_find/Parshah_Talk/Parshah_Talk.html
Fun stuff.
My primary objective is to maintain connectivity with God; otherwise it’s “business as usual”: work, kids, dog, wife — never a dull moment 🙂
I am sorry brother … I must not have understood the question. Let’s just start with tactical obedience. Keep the Shabbat! Celebrate the gifts that are the Biblical Festivals! Don’t eat animals that are not meant for food! Lend money without interest when necessary to other believers! When we see someone broken down on the road … stop to help them! Do not get a tatoo! If we can’t obey the literal commands that apply in our lives it is doubtful that we can really apply broader principles.
My brother the Torah is filled with applications and principles that can be applied to everything that we do. Case in point:
Duet: 23,14 And thou shalt have a paddle among thy weapons; and it shall be, when thou sittest down abroad, thou shalt dig therewith, and shalt turn back and cover that which cometh from thee. 23,15 For the LORD thy God walketh in the midst of thy camp, to deliver thee, and to give up thine enemies before thee; therefore shall thy camp be holy; that He see no unseemly thing in thee, and turn away from thee.
So one might say …. “and this means what to me?” Well there is an application …. “don’t defacate in the camp of Adonai’s army” …. and a principle. The principle deals with treating the very ground surrounding the kedoshim (the separated ones) with utmost respect … for Adonai is with us while in His service.
But we need to even broaden the principle further. The Earth is Adonai’s footstool and awesome wondrous creation. We are thus commanded to treat the land accordingly and serve as a “steward – care taker” of the land. So don’t be spoiling the land … no littering … no polluting, etc.
This example may seem like common sense …. but do purported believers really treat the Earth as Adonai’s wondrous creation?
If you were not aware there is a commonly accepted list of Mitzvot contained in HaTorah which was developed over time … just google the “613 Mitzvot” …. but this is not the point since Torah is unlimited and not bound by any conventions of men! 🙂
The idea is that we would Spiritually approach The Word and let it speak to us. When we see a Biblical application within Torah it is always a good practice to digest it. See it for its literal value! Develop a broader principle from a personal perspective (or take advantage of teachings that have already been provided) and then understand how this principle can be applied in everyday use. Once you go through the process individually i…. ts like “owning it” …. His character becomes ingrained!
This is why I believe David in the very first Psalm declares “But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in His law doth he meditate day and night.”
David is telling us that we should delight in knowing these mitzvot and still further we should keep in mind … and in our hearts their intent …. their meaning …. all the time. This my brother is Torah application. from a Hebraic perspective.
Forgive the lengthy response but I have heard this question before from folks who struggle to get going …. it seems as if there are times when it is like …. “How do I get started!
Perhaps this response will help … if not … maybe Skip can shed some light on the matter!
Thanks Drew and Michael and Jimmy,
Let me add only this much more. Most people balk at the idea of 613, but fail to realize that actually only a couple dozen of the 613 apply to any one given individual. After all, any single person is not male, female, child, parent, priest, Levite, High Priest, etc. all at the same time.
So, with Drew, you start. You start somewhere. Then you meditate and add. You add as you are able. Where it applies to you. It’s unlikely that you will have to follow the instructions for preparing a sacrifice or for dealing with menstruation, so follow the ones that apply to you right at face-value.
From there you look for principles. But not all of these will lead to principles. Some are just flat-out commands. One word of caution. While you will certainly lean on the guidance of the Spirit, human resistance and human craftiness notoriously distorts “guidance of the Spirit” into personal exceptions. That’s why the process is community based. There are no “personal” interpretations here. These instructions are deliberately designed to be lived out in community so that they are transparent. Mitzvot are not done in secret and no biblical interpretation is private. After all, Jeremiah told us that we can’t trust our own private views, can we?
Skip,
I was recently listening to one of your teachings when you stated that Gentiles convert and Jews repent. As i was reading in Acts 28:27 this morning the quote from Is. 6:9-10 uses the word convert in my translation. As i researched the Greek it appears to be the same Greek verb “epistrepho” as used in Acts 26:18, however it seems that those being referred to in the context of the scripture are some portion of the Roman Jews that were not persuaded by what Paul was teaching. What am i missing?
Thanks,
Kevin
You can start by looking at the Hebrew text of Isaiah, not the Greek translation of that text in Acts. There you will find shuv, to turn, repent, turn around, NOT convert. The same context appears in the story of the Malta shipwreck and the conversation with leading Jews in Malta.
This compound occurs 579 times in the LXX, 408 times for שׁוב, 30 for סבב, 24 for פנה, 11 for הפךְ and another 27 for 17 Hbr. verbs.4
. Vol. 7: Theological dictionary of the New Testament. 1964- (G. Kittel, G. W. Bromiley & G. Friedrich, Ed.) (electronic ed.) (723). Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans.
AND
In Ps. 19:7 again the LXX has in mind an alteration of the state of the soul under the influence of the Law and this has to be called “conversion,” whereas the Mas. seems to presuppose restoration in the sense of reviving. The same applies in Ps. 23:3; 85:4, where the compound is used for שׁוב trans. Ιερ. 38(31):18 in the Mas. reads: “Cause me to turn, that I may turn,” but the LXX has the more developed: “Convert me, that I may be converted,” cf. Lam. 5:21 and also 1:16, but not 1:11, 19. This gives a basic sense to many passages which speak of the turning of the people in admonition or warning, in positive or negative statements.
. Vol. 7: Theological dictionary of the New Testament. 1964- (G. Kittel, G. W. Bromiley & G. Friedrich, Ed.) (electronic ed.) (724). Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans.
Thanks for the response. If if am understanding correctly the variance comes in the translation from the Hebrew to the Greek.
right. What matters is the Hebrew background and usage in the LXX.
Would this also apply to Luke 22:32 when Peter got told to strengthen the brethren after he got converted (went through the denial of his Master and subsequent heart repentance in that touching scene on the seashore after the Resurrection)?
Peter converted? I don’t think so. He went through a renewal process and reaffirmed Yeshua as the Jewish Messiah.