Naming the Beast

The beast that you saw was and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and to go to destruction.  And those who dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come.  Revelation 17:8 NASB

Name – As we examine the idea that the sacrificial death of the Messiah occurs before the foundation of the world (see Revelation 13:8), we are confronted with the question about the proper referent for the phrase “before [from] the foundation of the world.”  Exegetes who would transfer the phrase from its location at the end of the verse in 13:8 so that it modifies “names” instead of “Lamb” sometimes use the similar wording in Revelation 17:8 as justification.  In 17:8, the phrase “before the foundation of the world” seems to be attached to “whose name is not written,” so they argue that is the proper placement in 13:8 as well.  But this deserves a closer look.

Any linguistic justification for shifting the prepositional phrase in 13:8 must be based on the position of the phrase in this verse, 17:8.  But this justification cuts both ways.  If I am allowed to move the prepositional phrase in 13:8 to match what I find in 17:8, am I not also allowed to move the phrase in 17:8 to another part of the verse?  Why can’t I move the phrase to modify “dwellers on earth” rather than “name not written in the book”?  Then 17:8 would read, “and the dwellers on earth from the foundation of the world whose name has not been written in the book of life . . .”  If the prepositional phrase location is fluid in 13:8, why isn’t it also fluid in 17:8?  Rewriting 17:8 in this way seems no more or less linguistically possible than the emendation proposed by various translations of 13:8.

There is also some paradigmatic justification for modifying Revelation 17:8.  The verse concerns the visibility of the beast.  It employs the phrase “was, and is not, and is to come,” commonly understood by end-times theologians as an allusion to resurrection.  Whatever the actual meaning of this expression, it is clear that the circumstances surrounding the beast are observable to the dwellers on earth.  That is why they “marvel to see” the beast.  This is not a hidden event.  But now we face another issue.  The ESV, NIV and RSV make another emendation that changes more of the meaning.  Rather than translating the verb and the noun as singular, these translations provide a plural rendition.  Now it appears as if there are specific, individual names in this book.  But the Greek uses singular constructs, describing only a “name not written.”  These translations import the idea that God keeps a record of every individual.  But this concept does not dominate Hebrew thinking.  Hebrew thinking is communal.  It views those who are God’s children as a whole.  Thus, “all Israel will be saved” is not about every individual of Jewish origin.  It is about the totality of those who follow YHWH designated by “Israel.”  Perhaps “name not written in the book” has the same communal application, i.e., all those as a whole who are not His children, not specific individuals.  Furthermore, the phrase “from the foundation of the world” could be applied to the beast.  Its name is not written in the book.  In fact, given the fluidity of Greek positioning, the singular noun and verb here are more likely to modify the singular therion (beast) than the plural emendation.  But there are more issues than this.  The Greek pronoun hos (whose – as in “whose name”) is plural.  This would lead us to believe that “whose” refers to “earth dwellers,” but “name” is still singular regardless of the plural hos.  Perhaps we are faced with the Hebraic idea of a name as a community, not as individuals.

Even if we resolve this problem, we are still faced with the problem of the identity of the beast.  End-times advocates make attempts to identify the beast as something or someone.  But behind this interpretation is a presupposition about the structure of time.  The Greek idea of time is linear.  Events happen once and are never repeated just as points on a line are sequential.  If John’s vision employs a Greek view of time, then the arrival of the beast occurs at a specific point in the timeline of human history.  The beast has a unique “name” identifying its existence on the time line.  But the Hebrew view of time is not linear.  It is a cycloidal curve, the path traced out by a point on the circumference of a circle as it travels along a surface.  Think about a tire rolling down a hill with a red dot at one point on the circumference.  Then follow the path of the dot.  Therefore, from an Hebraic perspective, the presence of the beast is concomitant with the creation of Mankind.  As long as there have been dwellers on earth, the beast has been with us.  That the beast is manifest in some fuller way at some further point does not entail that there was no beast prior to this manifestation.  It simply entails that we now observe the evidence of the existence of the beast in a new way.  In fact, we might argue that the phrase “was and is not and is to come” is a deliberate allusion to the same continual but hidden presence of Yeshua, who was (before the foundation of the earth), was not (observed to die) and is to come (will return), perhaps to indicate that the pattern of the beast mimics the pattern of the Christ.  If we read the text this way, then modifying “dwellers of earth” with “from the foundation of the world” simply indicates that since the creation of Man the character of the beast has been present.  The serpent was in the Garden before we got there.

What have we learned?  We learn that the text of the English Bible sometimes makes alterations based on presuppositions, both theological and linguistic.  This is not atypical, but it is something we need to be aware of.  We also learn that John’s Greek text isn’t as clear as we might like.  What John had in mind remains a mystery.  This should help us avoid the mistake of pronouncements about the “end times.”  Until we can talk to John, some things will be left uncertain.

Finally, and perhaps most importantly, we learn that God is in control.  How He maintains His control over human history is a great mystery.  But we do not need to fear that the world isn’t under His direction.  We might not be able to say exactly what John meant, but we know that John advocated ruthless trust, and that is good enough until we see face-to-face.

Topical Index:  name, beast, from the foundation, Revelation 17:8, Revelation 13:8

Subscribe
Notify of
19 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Michael

Revelation 20:14
Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Hmmm Makes me think of Johnny Cash

JOHNNY CASH – RING OF FIRE LYRICS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhWJF35Q81k

Love is a burning thing
And it makes a fiery ring
Bound by wild desire
I fell into a ring of fire

I fell into a burning ring of fire
I went down, down, down and the flames went higher
And it burns, burns, burns, the ring of fire
The ring of fire

I fell into a burning ring of fire
I went down, down, down and the flames went higher
And it burns, burns, burns, the ring of fire
The ring of fire

The taste of love is sweet
When hearts like ours meet
I fell for you like a child
Oh, but the fire went wild

I fell into a burning ring of fire
I went down, down, down and the flames went higher
And it burns, burns, burns, the ring of fire
The ring of fire

I fell into a burning ring of fire
I went down, down, down and the flames went higher
And it burns, burns, burns, the ring of fire
The ring of fire

And it burns, burns, burns, the ring of fire
The ring of fire
The ring of fire
The ring of fire

LaVaye Billings

Michael, You are something else, remembering Johnny Cash’s Ring of Fire, Yes, drugs could have helped write that one, or was it his beautiful June Cash, at least it appears she gave some stability to his life. Or that is what I seem to remember from many many years back. L.B. —- I must stay up and wait for this night to end.

willow

Thinking out loud…. I was studying Sh’mot on Shabbat and came across 2 statements that seem

to connect some dots with this idea of ‘slain before the foundation of the world” and that YHWH’s

complete faithfulness -i.e. that whatever He says is a ‘done deal’ – even before it actually

happens on our end of things…. First in Exodus 3:7 – most translations have something similar to

YHWH saying to Moses, “I am aware of their sufferings” like He is looking down and sees their

troubles, but I found that it says “yadati et makobaw” = I KNOW their PAIN! When I looked to

see where makobaw was found – I discovered it is the same word used in Isaiah 53:3 … a man of

pain, and vs 4 …and our pains from which he suffered” !! Is this the right dot-to-dot connection?

Then in the Gospels, Yeshua corrects the Sadducees for their wrong understanding about the

Resurrection by saying that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, are not among the dead, but the living –

‘to Him all are alive” Luke 20:37-38. This is before Yeshua’s resurrection, and before the

resurrection that we are waiting for…????????

Are these things related to this concept?

LaVaye Billings

Skip, focusing on the last paragraphs you wrote. YES, YES, a million times amen! I recall when the Lord began to reveal Himself to many anew in the 1970’s, and many of us in Houston during that time were included. That did knock down some denominational doors, truly a great outpouring of His Holy Spirit. ( Yes, there were abuses of that, history shows that it happens, but when all is filter out, settled down, great gain has come.) When I read above ” God is in control”—you need not fear– I was drawn into recalling the ones that were teaching in the book of Revelation, people became obsessed with end time scriptures. or apocalyptic literature. So I joined in studying the scriptures and books on these things. I would get up very early in the morning and whenever I found time from my heavy work load. ( We raised four children of our own, helped raise many others who fell through the cracks, and I taught school for 26 years, since retirement;we have done one or one ministry with our own resources). One book that I remember reading was by Hal Lindsey, “The Great Planet Earth”. it was the rage. Gradually I began to question myself although most of those I was in contact with, were enjoying it greatly. One day when I was alone and meditating, and praying, the Lord spoke to my Spirit as clear as any voice, but not an audible one, “LaVaye, you could spend all your time, all your years doing this, and it would accomplish very little for the Kingdom’s sake, or yours, use your study time for something more valuable.” I guess that was 35 or 40 years ago, and since then I have given very little time to it, and certainly will not debate it at all!—–The only value I have seen, is that it may turn your interest to the Entire Bible, and to seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and the FULL COUNCIL OF GOD’S WORD.
If anyone is reading this p.m. please ask the Lord to give me wisdom now to decide whether I need to call 911 for my husband to be taken to ER, I had to stop this writing with a new and different illness for him, not his severe congestive heart one that he is barely living with past few weeks. The new severe pain subsided after 15-20 min. and he has gotten in bed to see if he can sleep.
Yes, daily one day at a time God is in control of our lives- truly a great mystery- we do not know how but He is! Last night my near 84 year old husband had the best night of rest he has had since about Oct. 12. and being out of the hospital since Nov. 11. We are walking in the shadow of death, and trying to walk out what God has worked in us. Thanks for your prayers. L.B.

Pam

How are you today dear sister?

Ester

Thanks Skip, such provocative deep thoughts presented here, typically of Skip.

Right, the beast has been from the beginning, at the Garden, and, as with the beastly nature, it is good at forgeries and imitations, even to the very idea implanted in some folks that it is “omnipresent”!

We learn that the text of the English Bible sometimes makes alterations based on presuppositions, both theological and linguistic. -quote True, and sound.

Finally, and perhaps most importantly, we learn that God is in control. How He maintains His control over human history is a great mystery. -quote
Simply and plainly, HE is THE Creator of all things, and has FULL authority over all, Amein!
What an awesome YAH we have, and to love and serve!

To beloved sister L.B.-
Abba YHWH is with you and your husband, you shall fear NO evil, He will see you through! Amein!
His shalom upon you! Blessings and love to you,
Ester

Pam

“To beloved sister L.B.-
Abba YHWH is with you and your husband, you shall fear NO evil, He will see you through! Amein!
His shalom upon you! Blessings and love to you,”
Amein!

Brian

LaVaye Billings,

May the Shar Shalom surround and embrace you both completely! Please keep us posted.

In His Care, Brian

LaVaye Billings

To all who read, prayed, and the ones who wrote! I continue to be in awe over what happened: yes, we both have been surrounded and embraced with HIS Care . The night I wrote was long–almost no sleep but went to bed by my husband as usual, it seems that being near me is more peaceful to both of us, even if he is often moving, gasping for breath, trying to be comfortable with only 50 percent of his hear working. I also know most of his movements and whether I need to do something. The drugs have not been working together as hoped by an excellent Heart group. He has been home almost two months after several days in hospital. Back to the long night, I just begin to cover my head with my sheet and just pray with honesty about whether I had totally released him to the Lord unto death, if that was what was going to happen. I really thought I had, but I earnest stated again something like Paul did in Phillipians 1:21-24 in a manner appropriate for me to relase my ill older husband and not plead for him to continue to live if his days were numbered and it was time. Without any hidden motives or agendas in it for me, trying to do this is very heavy thinking, examining yourself so not to err as the caregiver! Finally after a few hours I got some peace, and began to thank the Lord for ALL HIS BENEFITS IN OUR LIVES AND THE LONG LIVES WE HAVE HAD. My husband dosed off, and I did too. Suddenly I awaken and knew exactly what I was to do. Call not the heart group, but the Primary Care Dr. make an urgent appt. and let him check this new issue out, and tell us what to do. BUT, he was working in a Family Medicine Group in another town. I would have to drive in the cold & rain, and register as a drop in, sit and wait. I knew my husband could not do it. Two weeks before, this Family Medicine group had advertised with a picture one of their M.D. that had been with them several years but had gotten some citation several years ago when he had been ill, and the local paper published it and a year or so later the entire TX Medical Chief’s rebuked him to limit his pratice in some manner. But did not take his license away. I had remembered reading it, did not know the man, or one thing about him. But patients of his wrote many articles in the paper for his defense. It seemed that the paper had really “tried” him and wrote their own verdict. They have done it in different areas previously. So I had decided with what he had been through that M.D. would have compassion for my husband, recalling I had truly sought the Lord’s face, I asked the desk if this M.D. could see us. The receptionist replied, how soon could we be there. ASAP, 30 minutes, yes, We went, all the records done, and three minutes after the MD entered the room, he examied the large sack like human bubble in the groin area & said you have a double hernia, it is very serious, and I want you at the large hospital ASAP (where ED had spent the days with the Austin Heart Group two months before). The Dr. I will have the office make the call for you to be taken directly to a room, and be prepared for surgery after the Heart Dr.s have their input with the surgeon, who turned out to be a beautiul young lady from Trinidad. The Primary Care Dr. said to me that if I did not want to drive the hours distance in the bad weather, he would call 911 and have EMS take Ed. We said that we needed to run by the house and get some clothing, etc. and we would decide.
We came home, and I was getting some friends on the phone ( none our children live near)and my husband said to me, or you sure you are not afraid to drive. See, my husband does not like for me to drive him around, although I have never had a wreck, only one ticket in all my years. It is definetly an ego thing and the older he becomes the worse he is about. So I assured him that I could, I had driven many years in Houston, and if he would keep his mouth closed and not tell me how to drive, unless I was truly about to make a huge mistake, I could do it. He agreed— So I drove us there in 55 min. and he even said that I did a good job! talk about all the bias against women– even being a professional person, and my husband is one, too. BUT BUT– you all know about this- Skip has written plenty on it. The surgery went well, all teams worked together, heart group and hospital surgeons, nurses, etc. We got home today, Thurs. at 5:10 p.m. totally beaten, exhausted, got things in the house. I prepared soup from what we had in freezer and ref.. He is sound asleep.
Did I add that through all these weeks home, one of the difficulties we have is getting all the heart drugs working together. Well it appears that it could be that we found it today. As because of the surgery, today only one of his past regular heart drugs could be used. It was given and he suddenly became so ill, could not breath, working with the RN, then Advanced Heart Nurse Practioner, we are now going to isolate this drug at home for a short period of time, and see if it continues it probably be the drug that has hindered the others. It will be exchanged with another. So we will see. But up until today, we had no clue. A reminder only 50 percent of his heart is working at all. I hope this will bless someone, I must go to bed. Next two weeks seem full of appts. with Dr.s. IT SEEMS TO ME GOD WAS RIGHT THERE WITH US AS HE ALWAYS IS. ===AND WILL BE –NO MATTER WHAT–L.B.

Kate Schear

Lavaye, thanks for the update.

Pam

Praise Yah!

Pam

Thank You for your testimony Lavaye. Still praying. Shabbat Shalome.

Brian

LaVaye Billings,

Great news to read this morning! May you both continually rest in His abiding presence.

Michael and Arnella Stanley

LaVaye, Arnella and I will be praying for you and Ed. It is heart warming to see your love in action after all these years together. This is where  a “marriage made in heaven” should lead… to rock solid ground!  I thank Yah that I have a wife, who like you has that same father/ daughter relationship with Abba,  and as a result  radiates that same light of love and care toward me as you do toward your husband, especially in his ongoing medical trials. May He strengthen and bless you both. We thank Yah for your example to the younger women in this community. In Him,  M & A

Mary

LaVaye,
So blessed to hear from you and to listen to your testimony. Thank you for letting us know how you and Ed are persevering in faith and encouraging all of us to trust in His tender care and faithfulness.

Mary

“But we do not need to fear that the world isn’t under His direction. ”

Agreed, we should be properly “fearing” YHWH and NOT the world. In so doing, WE will be under His direction.
I must say, if church folks spent more time pondering ( studying and meditating) on His instruction rather than gathering at all the end time hoopla meetings, we would be ready no matter what happens or when.
I gathered with some folks who spent more time on sensationalism than study of The Constitution of Yeshua’s Kingdom. The “head pastor” quit “pastoring” and left the group. A lot of good all His teaching did for him personally. He has totally disfellowshipped from anyone now.
Just sayin’

Pam

“I must say, if church folks spent more time pondering ( studying and meditating) on His instruction rather than gathering at all the end time hoopla meetings, we would be ready no matter what happens or when.”

So true Mary!

What we tell our fellowships is that if we simply read YHVH’s instructions and DO what it says, (Keep Shabbat, sight the new moon, celebrate the feasts, etc……) THE WAY IT SAYS TO DO IT, then we will ALWAYS automatically be in the right place at the right time doing the right thing when He comes. Think Passover and Shavuot/Pentecost in the year Yeshua fulfilled those feasts. They were all obeying the commandment to be there. And we will always be watching, waiting, studying, meditating, and teaching as we walk out His Torah day and night. How hard is that?

For this commandment which I command you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome . De.30:11 & 1Jn 5:3

Mary

Yes, we need more teachers of Torah. We need schools that teach Torah. First things first, line upon line, precept upon precept…obedience to the Word is what will work in the world to come…not your eschatology.
I think it is somewhat obvious the mess current seminaries have gotten the formal church into. Fat off of all the fluff, confused and bewildered saints? I would rather be reigned in by the staff of the Shepherd now than be beaten into oblivion by the rod of iron later.
We need shepherds that will teach and do what Scripture commands rather than preaching someone else’s anti-semitic commentary. They lift comments out of those commentaries as heartily as they do the Scriptures. Of course, the “bad” things are ignored (like many early christian “church fathers’ antisemitic rants and Spurgeon’s anti christmas/easter comments)…much like what is considered “bad” or Jewish in the Bible.

Sadly, for many years, I was engaged to that teaching and preaching. So thankful for Psalm 119:105. Now I am betrothed to my Beloved and am being adorned to please only Him! Hallelu Yah!

PRAY church PRAY! and may we be thankful for His kindness to us.

Shabbat Shalom

Pam

Amein and Amein