The Shocking Results
Then Yeshua said to the Jews who had believed in Him, “If you continue in My word, you are truly My disciples.” John 8:31
Disciples – Something shocking happens in the Gospel use of the term “disciple.” We don’t notice it in English, but in Greek the results light up the sky like fireworks. The Greek word for “learner” is manthano. In Greek thought, this word is connected to didasko (to teach). It comes from the idea of cognitive activity. It is more correctly translated “pupil” since it implies “one who learns something taught.” It is distinguished from mathetes (disciple) because mathetes means someone who has adopted the lifestyle of the teacher. In other words, a pupil learns information while a disciple copies the master’s rule of conduct and attitude.
What’s shocking is that manthano is hardly ever used in the Gospels. It appears in Matthew only three times, in Mark only once, in John twice and not at all in Luke, in spite of the fact that there are many occurrences of the associated verb, didasko. In fact, most of the time the word really associated with Yeshua’s followers in akolouthein. Akolouthein is from the verb akoloutheo. It means “to follow after, to go behind.” The Hebrew equivalent is halak ‘ahar. You can see these two words in Hosea 2:5. They mean “to go after.” In translation, Yeshua calls his followers mathetes, but they are almost never called manthano. Why? Because manthano is about communicating information. It is about pupils learning facts. It is not about active, behavioral transformation. It is not about “following behind” the Master. When Yeshua invites someone to “follow me,” he employs a Hebraic concept that means much more than gathering more information about God. He means that his followers adopt the same life purpose and behavior that he demonstrates. We are to be followers, not pupils, and those who are followers are truly disciples. No man who is only a pupil is a real disciple.
What does this mean for us? Obviously, the first thing it means is that if we are truly His disciples, we will be followers of His life in actions, thoughts and attitudes. Pupils gather information. Followers discover personal transformation. If our lives are not drawing closer and closer to the model of Yeshua’s life, then we are not halak ‘ahar.
Secondly, it means that most “discipleship” classes are really efforts to provide information for a manthano – a student – not a follower. If discipleship is to become instruction in following, then it must include behavior, attitude and thinking. Simply knowing more about a book of the Bible is not discipleship. Until what we learn is absorbed into how we live, there is no discipleship (and in the Hebrew view, there is no learning either). All following includes active obedience.
Finally, the shift from manthanein to akolouthein is in line with the Shema. To hear is to obey – not to catalog, analyze or examine. A follower walks behind. His steps are the steps of the one who leads. Perhaps we need to have “Follower” classes rather than “Discipleship” classes. We certainly need to depart the land of information-gathering and step on to the path of following.
Topical Index: disciple, manthano, mathetes, halak ‘ahar, follower, John 8:31
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Can I be brutally transparent for a moment? It’s a bit scary, to tell the truth. I don’t always know how to be akolouthein. With two small children and a full-time job, I don’t even have time to have a life or friends. The brief (and often interrupted) moments of quiet I sometimes get at 5am are the only time when I have to even open God’s word. And then I read but often don’t know how to apply. It’s awesome and eye-opening to see new things in the Bible, but I can barely remember my name sometimes, much less what I read in the early morning darkness. This site provides a huge amount of insight, and one thing that it does it keep me thinking about what I learned through the day… but I’m still stuck at manthanein.
How do you do it? How does a person go from being a hearer to a doer?
I will say that I am more sensitive to those still small whispers, and I am more often able to rely on God’s strength and provision, but is that what this means? How awesome it would be to be a follower, to know people deeply enough to be able to bare my soul and actually have the time to sit down and talk (does this count?), and to learn to live what I learn. I crave this sometimes, but at this point in life it doesn’t seem to be possible (to find time to “get out,” not to live out what I learn). But I also recognize that being mommy is definitely something that God has called me to be, especially with my oldest’s special needs.
And yet, God is holy, and He above all others knows the longings of my heart – to be a doer and not just a hearer, to have true friends and not just acquaintances, to be both a follower and a leader (which is a terrifying, possibly ludicrous, thought that someone, even my children, would look at my life and think I know enough of anything to follow my attempt to learn and imitate Yeshua’s life), and to fit all the information I gather into a map for life instead of a collection of fascinating facts.
Maybe I’m the only one who feels that way – that being mommy has consumed my life to the point where I don’t always know how to step outside that role and be Amanda (or rather how to find the time to do that), and that more importantly, I am at a loss as to how to move from being a gatherer of information to a true follower of Christ.
*End of scary soul-baring moment* How do you do it? I’d love to know!
🙂
Your post is a perfect example of being a “doer”. The rate of movement is not nearly as important as the direction.
“The rate of movement is not as important as the direction.” Good point! It’s so easy to think that if I can’t see or feel a lot of FAST movement then I’m not moving fast enough. In a fast-food generation, I do get stuck there.
How do I stop being a “doer” (as that doesn’t seem to be a particularly good thing).
And how does that get reconciled with James’ statement to not just be hearers of the Word but doers? Or perhaps that is where the direction part comes in… slowly but surely go in the right direction… but it still seems like I’m “doing.”
I think I’m confusing myself… too much Greek “logic” isn’t working so well this morning.
Oh never mind my comment. I misread my statement and then misread the comment… WAAAY too early to be thinking this morning! Sorry about that.
The point isn’t moving away from doing. The point is to BE a DOER, but that moving quickly isn’t the goal. The goal is “doing” in the right direction.
Thanks Skip! 🙂
Dear Amanda,
You’re already ‘doing it’. You’re working as a mother and teacher – two of the most potentially influential roles on earth (and two of the most demanding) – applying the ‘collection of fascinating facts’ by being a good mother and teacher.
You obviously have a heart after God and he’ll be influencing your children and students through your acts of service, manner, words, attitudes and ways of relating. His Spirit is working with you in all your daily responsibilities, when you’re responding to the ‘still small voice’ and even when you’re not aware of Him.
Thanks for the reminder that He knows the longings of our hearts. I needed that. (Thankyou for the ‘doing’ you do here on this site – I’ve been blessed and encouraged to keep going many times after reading your comments).
I pray our Father will make a way for you to get refreshing time-out.
Hi Amanda,
I’m always struck when I look at the time stamp on your posts and often marvel at your willingness to get up so early, read Today’s Word and actually leave a comment…given all your other responsibilities.
I see you as a TEACHER and a DOER in the example you model for others by your commitment to spend time in G-ds word…even when you’re exhausted.
I also see you as an obedient FOLLOWER of the Yeshua’s model. He too got up in the wee hours of the morning to spend time with His Father. Even his disciples weren’t always willing to do that.
I think you’re an amazing young woman and mother and I suspect G-d is preparing you for even more amazing things than you’re already doing…in His good timing. Right now, I’m thinking you’re EXACTLY where he wants you to be.
You’re an inspiration and a blessing to me.
“When the student is ready, the Teacher will show up.” It has been said-(and rightly so..) “it takes two to Tango!” The must be a Teacher and there must be a student. One to impart and one to receive. It takes two… In every relationship-it takes two!
One who is Able and one who is willing. It takes two. “Two” also, has been established as the number of witness. (We’ll have to examine the practice of Gematria one day, brother Skip!) Numbers, colors, names,places- all “testify” to the grace of G-d toward us.
“To teach” and “to learn”- the same word in Hebrew! The words of Yeshua (his disciples referred to Him as “Rabboni”/Teacher), declare: “Take my yoke upon you and learn of me- for I am meek and lowly in heart and you will find rest unto your souls.” Because His words are eternal,- these words found in Matthew 11.29 apply to us today, who would know more of this Giver of Life.
Simon Peter gets a bad rap in many places, but at this particular time-he got it right when he said: “Lord, to whom shall we go? You (alone) have the words of eternal life. (John 6.68)
Where would we be without the word of G-d? LOL!- I’d be lost as a goose. I’d be nowhere and going nowhere. Think/ Selah..- (is it okay to think?), of life without the word of G-d. – Wow! Think of Muslim countries and other countries also where G-d’s word is outlawed and to own a copy is a crime. We are so blessed to have the word of G-d, alive and living- forever! Thank you LORD, for the revelation of Yourself, given to us within your Torah. -For this we give you praise! Amen.
Amanda,
You are a “doer” as you follow Holy Spirit’s leading while attending to your children and your work:) I know you know this. Those of us who are “doers” always look beyond what we are presently “doing” to where we think we should be “doing” and become frustrated:) I know this all to well! One of the things that helped me is to focus on “being”. We will do as we are lead while being who He created us to be. Seasons change. I am now in a season of being grandmother and look for those wonderful moments of discipleship with my grandchildren:) God bless you and just keep following.
One of the things that helped me is to focus on “being”.
Hi Donna,
I think that is a good point.
Sometimes we rely too much on doing things and get ourselves into a “vicious cycle.”
When if we could just focus on “being there,” in the “here and now, ” things might be okay.
Thank you for your encouragement. I do tend to get stuck in a cycle of “doing.” It reminds me of Martha who got frustrated at Mary, who ultimately chose the better way – sitting at the feet of Yeshua. 🙂
You know, this morning is weird. I think most of my life, especially as I said in my not-quite-focused comments above, I’ve thought of being a “doer” as being a bad thing. But clearly it has to do with the purpose and context of “doing.” There’s a time to “do” (like James says to be a doer of the Word, acting out the faith we have in Yeshua), and there’s a time to “be” (like Mary listening to the voice of her Lord).
My dear Amanda,
You have expressed, I suspect, what many of us feel. Thank you for your transparency. Even as a great-grandmother I feel some of that overwhelming sense of not doing enough. There I go again! Donna was right, we should more often concentrate on “being” rather than doing. There were days and sometimes weeks as a young mother that I wondered why G-d even tolerated me. I never felt I had listened enough,learned enough, nor done enough. I still feel that way at times. It is scary to look deep inside and wonder how we measure up. Yet here I am at this stage of life looking forward to the next challenge.
I think it is very important that you absorb what Skip said about rate of movement and direction. There will be times when you feel you have moved light years in the rate of growth, and then there are times like now when you feel you are the tortoise instead of the hare. Your children are a part of your growth plan in G-od’s timing. I think it is hilarious that while we are young and have the brain cells left to absorb teaching we also have the most responsibilities as parents. There are never enough hours in the day to accomplish what we think we should as parents and as disciples. Now that I have fewer parenting responsibilities and probably fewer active brain cells, I am finally able to spend extended times in study,etc. Rejoice in the gift of your children. They will be gone ever so quickly. Remember that every little thing you take in now, you can transmit to your children. They will have a head start because YOU are their mother and you are “being” the mother He wants you to be.
This is a perfect example of the difference between the Greek-individual-Western view of parenting and the Eastern-Semitic-Hebrew view. Did you notice that Gayle said that now she has the time, after her children are grown. Ah, what do you think the “elders” in the community are there for? Do you suppose that they have an integral part to play in raising children? If the parents have the responsibilities for all the routines, safety, provision, etc., don’t you think that some of the spiritual growth should come from those who have the time – and the wisdom – to provide what most parents are overwhelmed to handle? What would our children’s lives be like with grandmother and grandfather were spiritual giants in their lives, directly, teaching, showing by a long life of example what the purpose of living really is? They would have a perspective that most parents can’t have – a perspective that can only come with hindsight.
Hi Skip,
Unfortunately, I’m afraid the Greek-individual-Western view is the dominant ideology in the Western world today; and the US has always been a “melting pot” of traditional cultures.
My friend David was invited to speak on neurophysiology at Bejing University a couple of months ago and the state of the country blew his mind.
David was amazed by value the Chinese put on the education and welfare of their children.
And how they can produce PhDs in mathematics with the same passion that we produce consumers of IPODs.
As David described his experience, China seemed to me to be an unparalleled combination of social Darwinism and business enterprise, held together by an ironclad infrastructure of extended families.
If the good old USA is already “no country for old men,” our children better be prepared for some stiff competition from places like India and China.
Some of my Chinese readers have often commented that Chinese social structure is much more like Hebraic culture than it is like the West. Interestingly, some Chinese characteristics of the language are also much more like Hebrew. And I have heard reports that the believing community in China more easily adopts a Semitic view as a result.
Good observation Skip … at a Bible Study not too long ago our group discussed in great detail the responsibilities for the Levites who had reached 50 years of age and no longer performed their designated service.
It was concluded that the elders would have provided discipleship and child bearing support amongst their duties in as much that there is no retirement contingency within The Lord’s employment plan. Additionally it should be noted that, unlike our culture, the value proposition associated with this “elder population” was tremendously high.
Sadly … in our culture … this discipleship support function has been pawned off, in large degree, to “the state” which plies its humanistic mantra …. and we have the audacity as a culture to wonder what the problem is!
First, thank you for the encouragement! Maybe I’m seeing more forest than trees. 🙂
Skip, your statement about the elders reminds me of the saying that it takes a village to raise a child. I think the hard part today is finding an elder who has that more Hebraic view of scripture. Unfortunately many of the “elders” in my community are firm believes in the Greek way of thinking and the “irrelevance” of Torah in our lives. Perhaps my children don’t currently have the blessing of a larger community who sees the need to look at things from a Hebrew perspective, but I can be the first in a line and be there for my grandchildren (assuming Yeshua hasn’t returned already, and I’m still here).
This is a simple question. Can you be a believer and not be a disciple?
good morning Carol.. the short answer to your question- “Can you be a believer and not be a disciple?” is “no.” (why?). For our part (the human side) “salvation” is easy- “sanctification”- the process of holiness/being conformed to the image of the Son is far from the “easy” path.
I am a creature made/formed/fashioned in the image of my Creator. I am a “trinity.” Body, soul and spirit. Before you shout- “a Greek freak!” – I promise, I am not attemting to “compartmentalize” my being. I simply would cease to exist without any of the three. I need all three to be “me.”
Testimony time. -I was given the gift of a new heart. At the age of 52- I had open-heart surgery to replace the aortic valve on the top of my heart with a St. Jude mechanical (metal) valve. Five years this December. I entered the hospital on December 8 and arrived home with a “new & improved!” heart December 16, just in time to spend Christmas with my family.
I can promise you this- Greek or Hebrew- I was an “emotional wreck.” I wept while eating a fresh Florida orange, sent by my family who reside in the southern part of the state. Now, where I come from, eating an orange does not necessarily “equate” with floods of tears. This is not “normal” behavior.
Why did I cry? (hey look Ethel- a man is baring his soul!- lol!) What caused this “outburst of emotion?”
It was “overflowing gratitude” to G-d for all He had done. To “be there” was a “miracle.”
“Life” is a gift. Please do NOT miss this. Life IS a gift. It is the gift of G-d. Your very breathing in and out sir/m’am is the gift of G-d. How easily we “forget”- the gift of our next heartbeat.
I have a “clicker” within my chest- a “metronome” that sounds off continually- 24/7. It gives new meaning to “with every beat of my heart!”-
We have (all) become “desensitized” to life. I say this- to my shame. (I now pause to ask forgiveness).
Do any of us have an idea of what we have “in Christ?” – I don’t think so. Due to the “distractions” of this world- (you know the drill) we have become “spiritually desensitized”. Spiritually “dull.” Seems like every now and then, we need a good ol’ fashioned “crisis” to enter our lives so “once again” we can “cry out” -to Him. – (“harsh”-or-“hello”).
Nothing like pain to issue a “wake-up” call. The purpose of pain- “wake-up.” Just how “fully” -“awake and aware” are you? Would a well-placed hat-pin do any good? (works for me- every time..)
Everyone who names the Name which is above every name has “entered into” the slow process of change. Those who are His are (in the process- this is called sanctification- the process of holiness) are being (not to worry-this is the LORD’s doings and it is marvelous in our eyes) conformed (a word of heat and pressure- thank you Skip) into the image of the Son.
In the every day- “normal” (hah!) lives we live, G-d shows up. Everytime and everywhere. The problem people is not with the Giver. The problem lies with us- the receivers. We do not have “ears to hear” nor “hearts to obey.”
Look of G-d to “show up” today in the everyday events of normal life. (Helpful household hint #1), “slow down.” -Yes, I am all too familiar with the rush of life and I promise to you- I “rebel” against it. I am trying my best to travel through this life with the emergency brake applied to “slow it down.” *hah!*
Our Father takes great delight in His children. “Look” at your children. Don’t glance at them sir/ma’am- “look” at them. Stare in wide-eyed wonder and let your heart overflow with gratitude toward the Giver who gave them to you. Now multiply the love within your heart a thousand times and you will have an “inkling” of how much our Abba loves us. He is (now) intricately and intimately involved “in the midst” of us. He is very much LORD of not only the “sweet by-and-by”, but also LORD of the “nasty now-and-now!”
I do not have the words necessary to proclaim the wonders of praise. I can be another “testimony” – the story of Paul and Silas who were bound in prison, and who at “midnite” sang and gave praise to YHWH is (of course) much more than a story.
Praise Him for dirty diapers!- Praise Him for pain! Praise Him for sorrow! Praise Him for “drudgery!” G-d is now “working” in all the “details” of our ordinary, everyday lives. Praise Him for the sunshine, praise Him for the rain. Praise Him for the taste of an orange, and then “taste it again- for the first time!”
If you define belief as mental assent to a proposition then possibly, yes, but using the Hebrew definition of belief, not it is not possible, because belief implies action. The Hebrew word “believe” is aman (aleph mem nun); the pictoral meaning is “the strength of the living waters”. Does that bring to mind, “If any one thirsts, let him come to Me and ask and I will give him rivers of living water…”?
The Hebrew word “faith” is from the same root – it is emunah and means “the strength of the living waters revealed“. How is it revealed? “You say you have faith without works, and I’ll show you my faith by my works“, said James.
Belief and faith, from a Hebrew mindset, imply actions in line with the Master’s instructions and will i.e. a lifestyle of obedience and submission to the Master’s teaching and instruction.
Can you be a “believer” and not be a disciple? It all depends on your definitions. Jesus was a Jew. He thought “Hebrew”, not “Greek”. I think I have an idea of the definitions He would use, and therefore I have an inkling that His answer might be, “No.”
The Hebrew word “believe” is aman (aleph mem nun); the pictoral meaning is “the strength of the living waters”. Does that bring to mind, “If any one thirsts, let him come to Me and ask and I will give him rivers of living water…”?
Hi Rodney,
Rather than a man, for some reason, Mem makes me think of the three Mothers, Alef Mem Shin.
And the amniotic waters of the mother’s womb (“Darkness, darkness, be my pillow”).
Chaos itself, Mem’s death without the way out (Derekh), isn’t it 🙂
Just as it is not possible to “hear” without “responding” in Hebrew (one verb for both), so it is not possible to “believe” without “obedience.” Christian theology of grace severed what is intimately bound together in Scripture. This break was not initiated because of the text. It was initiated because the Church reinterpreted the text so that actions alone might produce acceptable faith. Of course, this is also not possible in Hebrew. But the Reformers overreacted, discarding the vital connection in order to recover the lost dogma that God alone saves. We are the product of both Christian category mistakes. We have wavered between “works” and “faith” as if they were distinctly different. We have forgotten that “faith” is a verb.
One more thing, of course (isn’t there always just one more thing?). Saying that faith is a verb does not mean that there is a straight line between hearing and responding. More often than not, we hear and God shows infinite patience until we finally do respond. Following Him is a PROCESS, not a state of being. Therefore, it is seen over a long period of time, not at any one particular moment. So, while I could say that I am a believer and discover many faults in my walk, I cannot say that I am a believer if there is no progress toward godliness in spite of the discovery of many faults. It is DIRECTION, not position.
Skip, what you said about “The rate of movement is not nearly as important as the direction.” has been a blessing to me today. Thank you for sharing your faith. I have been taught by a well meaning Pastor that there are many who have claimed the Blood of Christ and believed but they seem to drop away one by one. There is so much more than meets the eye. Thank you Carl for your word and to all who have shared their hearts..thank you. Still in the stands reading what each and everyone has to say and hopefully with an open heart to what “IS”. thank you
Dear Amanda,
Your pursuit of God through the sanctifying blood of Christ, with all your heart, soul strength and mind is known to Him. He sees your heart, knows right where you are on your journey and loves you as a kind and compassionate Father. He knows how to bring about His plan and purpose for your life and is even now sustaining and making provision for you. May you be comforted knowing His plan for you is perfect and He will bring all things to pass in His time. “Be” blessed as you fulfill your calling.
good morning all… (just a short aside.. Mary- I am so blessed by your words- “evidence of a heart-change!”.
I believe it is possible for me to be “saved” all day long and for no one to know. I have the freedom to hide my “relationship.”
I am a (happily) married man. To some it may be an oxymoron to say “happily married”, but praise our good G-d, it is so!. (I just hope my “better half” feels the same way!). Thirty one years of marital bliss! .
How would you know I was “in a relationship” with this wonderful woman unless I told you? She knows, I know.. but how do you know? What “evidence” do you have?
What “evidence” is there, I ask, that I am a follower of the Way? G-d knows, I know- but how do you know? What is my “witness” to the outside world? Do I need to buy a t-shirt? or get a tat?
What is the greatest evidence to the (I will call these people-“so great a cloud of witnesses”) “unsaved” or for that matter “saved” world? Even a child is known by his “doings.” My words may say one thing, but what do my attitudes and actions say? If I am going to be a witness, what “evidence” is there of (we don’t like this word very much- do we?)- “conversion”. “Converting” from what? From a “heathen” to a “saint?”
I did not always exist. There was a “point in time” when I was born. When Will Rogers was asked for “proof” of his birth- he replied, “Well.. I’m here ain’t I?” In agreement with Will, I’ll also say “Heneni”- “here am I.”
I have “entered into” a relationship with YHWH. I provide the sinner- He IS the Savior. I know who I am- I’m (forever) finding out who He is. Even after thirty one years of intimate relationship with my beautiful wife (hope she’s reading this!), she is still “full of surprises!”- and that is a beautiful thing!. We serve a G-d of wonders- and that also is a “beautiful thing!”
My love and appreciation for the G-d who (now) is grows everyday. Another “evidence” of a changed life. Only one of many “evidences!” G-d’s book is chock full of “evidence.” If faith pleases Him, and faith comes to us through His word, maybe we had ought to actually read His book and pay a little closer attention to the words that proceed out of His mouth.
I have not read all of the comments but thoroughly enjoyed this post. It’s a subject that is near and dear to me.
This statement at the end is solid truth, at least, in my opinion.
“Perhaps we need to have “Follower” classes rather than “Discipleship” classes. We certainly need to depart the land of information-gathering and step on to the path of following.”
Most definitely we do.
Thank you for your ministry, Skip.