Torah – and all that stuff
Today I got an email from a long-time reader. It said:
Skip, I have been reading your posts regularly for many years now. I am unclear of the bottom line: Are we to be Torah bound as if Jews? If so how do we apply the 600+ Laws/Kingdom rules in our current society? If selectively, which ones, how and why or why not? I am a bit thick so dumb it down for me please. Thanks in advance for your consideration.
Since this might be a question for a lot of readers, I thought I would answer it publicly.
I believe that we Gentiles are grafted into the commonwealth of Israel. That means that we leave our past culture and kingdom and adopt a new culture and kingdom, the Kingdom of God, the God of Israel. This is no different than Gentiles who came into the Messianic fellowship in the first century. As James remarked, “They are taught Moses every week in synagogue.” So, cultural conversion is part of the process. I am not “saved” in order to get to heaven. I am saved in order to become part of what God is doing in the restoration of the earth, that His will might be done on earth as it is in heaven. And for that I need to be part of His Kingdom here.
Every kingdom has a system of governance, social expectations and practices that identify its citizens as members of the kingdom. I could not be a Roman citizen without meeting the Roman Empire’s requirements. Neither can I be a citizen of the Kingdom of God without meeting God’s requirements. Salvation is merely my entry invitation. It is not a guide to how I should live as a citizen of the Kingdom. And by the way, neither is “love” a guide to how I should live. It is a nice ambiguous concept, but it lacks all the details. Fortunately, God knew that we needed the details. Unlike all other ancient Middle-Eastern gods, the God of Israel provides a clear instruction booklet about what it means to be one of His own. He provided that booklet to the children of Israel after they left Egypt because He was establishing a new Kingdom, His Kingdom, and His children needed to know how to live differently than they had in Egypt. Other ancient gods merely demanded worship but did not provide instructions. YHWH does both. Aren’t you glad? What would it be like to live under a God who never told you what He expected? Oh, never mind, that’s what Christians under “grace” already have. You already know what that is like.
This means that Torah is not rules and regulations. Torah is freedom from ignorance about what God wants, freedom from worry that I will make an accidental mistake and freedom from concern about my purpose and destiny. Torah tells me how to please God and engage with others. Without it, I am walking in the dark.
Because Gentiles are grafted into Israel, Torah applies to them just as it applies to all citizens of the Kingdom. But here’s the caveat. Torah only applies to those who are the direct object of any particular commandment. So, if you aren’t a Levite, no commandment to the Levites applies to you. If you aren’t in Israel, commandments for people living in the land do not apply to you. If there is no Temple, then commandments that require actions at the Temple cannot apply. If you are a man, you have different requirements than if you are a woman. You get the idea. All of the commandments are instructions about how to live in God’s Kingdom, but not all of the commandments are for you. You have to decide which ones apply to you according to the commandment and your own circumstances.
Matt Woodward and I sat down one evening and went through all 613 Torah commandments. When we were done, we found less than 10 that applied to us that we weren’t doing at the time. Most of the ones that did apply were already part of our lives. We only needed to do something about incorporating 10 more. Hundreds, literally, did not apply to us.
Clear your head. Torah is not binding you. That is a Greek reaction of the idea of regulations. Torah frees you. Torah is not Jewish. It is God’s living instructions for all who are in His Kingdom. Following Torah does not make you Jewish. In fact, some commands of Torah don’t apply to Gentiles at all because Gentiles are not Jews. And contemporary Judaism is not the same as the Judaism of Yeshua’s time. Don’t let that scare you off either. We don’t selectively choose which Torah commands apply to us. Our circumstances and the command itself provide the selection process. It is determined by God, not by you and me.
So, don’t get overwhelmed. Go read the 613. Alter your life according to the ones that apply to you. Be happy that you know. Delight God and please others. Enjoy the freedom of knowing what God demands and how to do it. And have fun.
Is there a consolidated verse list of what you’re defining as the 613?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_commandments
The 613 are a basic enumeration of the commandments in the Torah.
Yes, Judaism 101 > 613 > will take you there.
So what I’ve heard most of my life in church about being an adopted Jew in Christ is not exactly the case?
Right, not exactly. If you aren’t born Jewish, and you don’t become a proselyte, then you aren’t Jewish, and becoming a believer in the Messiah does not make you Jewish. But it does graft you into the Kingdom. And in the Kingdom, your STATUS is the same as a Jew – saved by grace, devoted to serve. But the requirements for how to serve are a bit different, just as they are for a man versus a woman. By the way, when you enter the Kingdom, you are still female, right? You don’t suddenly become neuter. You aren’t treated any differently because you are a woman, but your sexual identity doesn’t change. Same thing with Jews and Gentiles.
I know this is 6 years old, but I wonder if I can get in before the 30 days. What do you see as the different requirements for service between say, a male Jew and a non Jewish male (or Jewish female and non Jewish female?) Do you go as far as the position that FFOZ has taken in this matter?
No comment on FFOZ. Sorry. As for the rest of your question, I am not quite sure what you mean by “requirements of service.” Perhaps you will elaborate.
Good job Skip. YHVH is so much bigger than so many give Him credit. The Torah is just a snapshot of that Character.
No reason to be afraid, even if there WERE 613! Think about it: the USA has more than 2,000,000 laws! Should that prevent you from being or becoming American? So why should 613?
(which are not even ‘laws’, b.t.w.)
Torah and all that stuff …WOW… is all I can say after my first reading of it. And it prompts me to ask your understanding/interpretation of Exodus 21, re slaves and the treatment of slaves and all that stuff.
Harry,
If you have never tuned in to Truth2U.org, you are missing out on some fun. They have a section called Torah Pearls, and a group of guys who explain the weekly readings. The portion to which you refer is Mishpatim, here: http://www.truth2u.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Truth2U-Nehemia-Keith-Mishpatim.mp3
I heard something the other day (concerning slavery) that I missed last year when I first heard this teaching. Kind of like most times I read Scripture and REALLY pay attention. 🙂
Very many of the instructions are for when you come into the land including the feasts as I understand it. How does that work for now?
Are you heading to Israel anytime soon? When you get there, some things apply that don’t apply outside the land. And when the Temple is built again, more will apply.
I understand that, but many say we are to celebrate the feasts now. Is it to remember them, ie, call them to our remembrance, or do you believe God intends us to “do the best we can.” I ask because I have turned this over and over in my mind, prayed about it, etc., and I really still do not get it. I struggle with adding to and taking away from his instructions. Does keep in this case mean “to hold in high regard” as it does with the commandments? Maybe I should look up the Hebrew words huh?
Okay, so what are the ones you already are living by, and the ten additional?
Do they not all fall under the simple 2–Love God above all and love others?
Look, just go to Judaism 101 > 613 and read the list. You will see right away which ones you are already doing, like #1 for example. And yes, they do all FALL under the summary verses that Yeshua gives (which are merely citations from the same 613 list). But summaries imply details. So, if you think you know them so well that you only need the summaries, great! But most of us need the details too.
Thank you Skip for providing this incredibly important and needed answer in a “simply stated” format. This appears to be so simple, which it really is; however, at the same time creates such confusion and division among those who really want to follow Yeshua. I know of a small congregation who has been fighting over this exact point for years now and probably will split over this issue. And I am also aware of a major “Hebrew Roots” organization who has publically flip-flopped on this issue more than once. No wonder there is so much confusion among well-meaning followers of Yeshua.
It’s frustrating and heart-breaking to see people struggle over this issue so much. Even if there were major differences in which commandments Jews and Gentiles should follow, which I really do not believe the case, wouldn’t you want to follow all of them you could out of pure love for our Abba? He reassured us that following them really should not be a burden. In fact, it should be pretty simple to do so. You are correct Skip when you say that there are very few of the commandments that we were not already following when we were part of the large “Christian Church” versus simply following Yeshua in the way he simply stated we could show our love for him, “If you love me, you will follow my commandments.” And I find it interesting to note that these few additional commandments that we follow after “making the switch” are those my Christian and non-Christian friends notice the most. Commandments like observing the Sabbath, not eating pork or shellfish (or even catfish), and attempting to observe and experience the festivals…these are the stumbling blocks. It amazes me to see people who genuinely want to follow Yeshua battling and splitting over these.
Our Greek way of thinking and living puts up powerful roadblocks. Even my 30-year old Christian son has asked me “Dad, why are you now doing all those Jewish things?” And I believe that is the question that really is the most asked. After I explained to him that these were not Jewish things, but commands from God for all believers, we had a great discussion about why and how the world (and worldview) changed beginning right after the destruction of the temple in AD 70 and continuing to this day. I feel like I rambling…so I am going to stop here Skip, but your simple explanation just keyed some thoughts I felt like I needed to write here this early morning. Thanks again Skip. Nice job….
Here’s the darker side of this whole issue. Dacy, Reed, Becker, Bennett and others have shown that historically the Christian Church deliberately re-invented itself by modifying, removing or nullifying Torah commandments in order NOT TO BE JEWISH. This is exactly the opposite of the common practice of those who first believed Yeshua is the Messiah. But the historical record is clear for anyone who cares to look at it.
What this means is that Christianity has an implicit anti-Semitic bias and has taught this bias as part of its very identity for nearly 2000 years. No wonder recovery of the thought of the first century believers is so difficult. It feels like treason – and it is often portrayed that way by the Church (“you are returning to legalism”).
I too am aware of the present controversy within the Hebrew Roots movement (and the people involved), but you are correct, keeping the commandments is an expression of LOVE FOR GOD, not a set of rules. Please watch Moshe Kipinski’s interview in the first Lessons from Israel DVD series. It is an amazing view of Torah, one that we should embrace.
That anti-Semitism began soon after the destruction of the temple in AD 70 and continues to this day in a variety of forms. And the Church has done the most in promoting that anti-Semitism. You are so right Skip that to follow all the commandments is viewed as treason by well-meaning friends in the Church. There is extreme pressure exerted to NOT RETURN TO LEGALISM. And the crazy part about all of this is that in reality recognizing and following all the applicable commandments gives us such freedom and security. It’s ironic that as adults we fight so hard against this concept, yet children implicitly know it and want it. As loving parents we provide boundaries for our children…not to be mean, but to provide safety and security for them. Children test those boundaries, yes, because they really want to know if they exist and where they exist. And sometimes they complain about them. But try raising a child without boundaries and they will feel abandoned and unloved. The kids implicitly know what the boundaries are all about. And maybe that is part of what Yeshua was talking about when he said “let the children come to me, for as such is the kingdom of heaven.” Kingdom rules include boundaries…commandments…not because God is some big meanie, but because he loves us and wants to provide us safety and security in everything we do, just as good parents do for their children. It should be our pleasure to follow those commandments out of love for him. People who claim following them is legalism are dead wrong! As wrong as if they said a child obeying a parent is legalism! I find that those who usually are the most adamant about that legalism are those that are typically the most trapped by the rules and traditions of the church and unfortunately are really under the forces of tremendous legalism. They have not experienced the true freedom that following the Torah and the commandments can bring.
Bingo Gary. You hit the nail on the head (at least you did from where I’m standing.) What a pleasure to express my love for The Lord by keeping His commandments. And to anyone who wants to pressure me?… I say, “Now who’s being legalistic?”
“the Christian Church deliberately re-invented itself by modifying, removing or nullifying Torah commandments in order NOT TO BE JEWISH.
Hi Skip,
I know very little about this period in history, but it seems to me that we can already see
Peter and Paul moving in “baby steps” away from the laws of Judaism
And because the Christian/Catholic church would become the dominant ideological state apparatus
And because the religious ideology/theology of the Catholic church comes out of the Talmud
The intellectual leaders within the early church itself must have been Jews
To have understood the theology in Hebrew
Just guessing
Thank you, Skip, for this clear elucidation of our responsibility as Christians to obey God through His commandments in the Torah. I need to re-evaluate my own life in terms of this, as a Jew. When I first believed in Yeshua as the Messiah, I was taught that I no longer needed to keep these commandments as a Christian and under grace, as were most of us.
You speak a lot about the Talmud and the rabbinic interpretations of the Law; are you suggesting we hold to those as well? Having grown up with a lot of legalism, I have some issues with that.
Bravo for pointing out the anti-Semitism in the church throughout history. Many of my friends belong
to different Protestant denominations, are Catholic, or Orthodox. Each has tried to convince me that
his particular branch of Christianity is the most correct and God-ordained. My response is that when
you can show me a church that has never persecuted or vilified Jews, I will think about it. No one really has an answer for that one.
I like your litmus test Emily. I had a friend with a lovely homeschooling family that wanted to share his Eastern Orthodox faith with me. I only knew about the icons, which after studying, understood more about, but still was troubled with the closeness to idolatry. The Orthodox website he referred me to was interesting. There was an early church father, possibly Chrysostom? that was responsible for alot of the litergy in the Orthodox Church. I did some research and found out he was very, very Anti-Semetic. That was enough for me. As Yehua said:
And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done [it] unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done [it] unto me.
I shared this with him, but he was not swayed. The sad thing is, I had heard that he had once investigated Hebrew Roots! I have heard this about many Christians searching for stable truth in the church. Unfortunately the Messy-anic Movement is so varied in practice and doctrine we turn many away!
For me, regardless, I have no place to go. I have found the source of truth and life, YHVH’s Torah!
Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
Blessings!
Randy
Wow! One of the best practical explanations of why we study Torah! Years ago, around the month of February,( I remember because of Purim) I was talking (praying) to G-d while driving to the public library when I heard “I’m going to take you where no man has ever gone before”. I thought “that is crazy ” I need to get out of the house more. Then, I put in the Torah cassette that I had just received in the mail and lo and behold, the theme song of Star Trek started playing. It was a skit about Purim that was using the Star Trek theme, with “Star Baby” as Esther, and Su Loo was changed to Sue You, etc. I have never laughed so hard in my life.
I did not understand what G-d had shown me until a few years ago. I believe He was referring to Torah study. If you think about it, the Torah movement that we are seeing today, has never happened before in the history of man. When Paul was preaching to the Gentiles, there were no “Christian Churches” so to speak, they were pagens. The Torah has just recently been opened up to the internet in 1998, according to a famous Jewish web-site, of course to reach the Jewish people, but in so doing, it is now available for ANYONE to research and study! This was not possible twenty years ago, our grandparents or those before them, did not have access to Torah teachings as we do today. We are truly a blessed generation to be able to participate in G-d’s instructions for life which will unite the Jews and Gentiles and hasten the return of Messiah. As Captain Kirk use to say “Beam me up Scottie”
Emily, I AM SO HAPPY TODAY because, upon waking and coming to Today’s Word, I read this:
“I need to re-evaluate my own life in terms of this, as a Jew.” To “meet” a Jew who recognizes Yeshua as Messiah is the most exciting thing in the world to me! Don’t we all need to re-evaluate!
WELCOME, Sister!!!!
Skip,
Thank you for your great response to this person and allowing us to become part of that conversation.
YHWH revealed His ways to His people in ancient times in contrast to all the so called gods who were silent! This is one of the most glorious truths that was liberating then and is still as liberating today!
It is hard to fathom why the Christian world will embrace the speaking God at the beginning of creation, but in the same breath try to silence His speaking from the mountain and try take away His breath to empower His people today. Yet, He is still speaking from Sinai and His breath is still breathing out and inspiring and enabling His people to walk out His character and reveal to His world who He is.
Thank you for all your hard work and commitment to allow those who have ears to hear the Creator and Giver of Torah.
Shalom shalom!
Excellent Skip! Thank you again for defining my intentions so much better than I can.
I visited one of our old churches last Oct 31st for a reformation day service. It seemed at the time a better option than a “Harvest Festival” The subject was Christianity vs. all the other religions of the first century and the summation of it was that people were born into there religions. To join another religion was nothing less than treason. But when you did so you took on all of the religious practices and cultural stuff. I was sitting there thinking OMG he’s gonna go there!
Then suddenly the message ricochet off his theology into the proposition that all other first century religions were sacral except Christianity. I conclude that he was correct. Christianity is a new non-sacral (if that can be a word) religion.
But the first century messianic believers were definitely a sacral society. I thought at the time I need to remember this. I need to spray spiritual roundup on this noxious weed every at opportunity as it springs up.
The Torah is the constitution of the Kingdom of God.
Lets just all Love Jesus is a kingdom of anarchy.
What a fabulous blessing to not be left in ignorance to do what is right in our own eyes.
Hallelu YAH!
THAT WAS EXCELLENT!
(yes, we are shouting that from our mountain!)
What you wrote is EXACTLY what He is showing us!!
On the same trail of TRUTH with you!!! HalleluYAH!
Thanks for saying all of that & sharing Skip!
We really appreciate YOU!
whew!
Praise YAHUWAH!
Hugs from your sister in YAH~
Chari 😀
What a refreshing post! I wish I could sit down with you Skip and get inside your head. Your posts are always inciteful and spot on. This one engenders questions for me though. For instance, you said “the Torah is not Jewish” and “Following Torah does not make you Jewish”. I agree and yet I disagree on these points. Here’s why. Paul said, But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God. “Jew” as you know, literally means, “one who praises (YHVH)”. We usually think of it as “one who is physically from the tribe of Judah”, or “someone who is of Israeli descent”. But Paul digs deeper. So if I paraphrase your quotes with this explanation, I would say: “The Torah is not of praise (toward YHVH)” and “Following Torah does not make you praise (YHVH)”. I think you would agree with these definitions and clarify that is not what you meant.
Christians today, even some who are intrigued with the Hebrew Roots movement, are afraid of “becoming Jewish”, or “living under the Law” as if G-d’s Torah was a cruel slavemaster. (To the flesh it is cruel, to the spirit it is life-giving).
I wonder why Jews and later Gentiles were immersed when they confessed Yeshua as Messiah. For the Jew immersion was a way of life (read Total Immersion: A Mikvah Anthology), self-nullification toward full sanctification. For the Gentile, this was one of the steps of conversion. Another was laying on of hands equivalent to appearing before a Beit Din. The only conversion requirement missing was circumcision which Paul argues is not necessary. My personal view is that this two-part conversion made Gentiles “sons of Abraham”, thus pre-dating the Torah revealed to Israel. Yet we know Abraham followed Torah in some aspect.
For I know him, that he will command his children and his household after him, and they shall keep the way of the LORD, to do justice and judgment; that the LORD may bring upon Abraham that which he hath spoken of him.
I moved out of the community of my youth to a new community six years ago. It was then I decided to “live as a Jew” based upon the revelation quoted above from Roamns. This has included: wearing tzit-tzit, a kipa, not working Friday night to Saturday night Sabbath, reading the weekly Torrah portion, keeping kosher, etc. People in this community know me as a Jew. Those who really know me know I accept Yeshua as my Messiah. Wearing my faith outwardly has led to countless opportunities to talk with others about my faith, which I wouldn’t have had if I “dressed like a Christian”. I am not saying everyone should do as I do, but they should not fear it either. I have learned alot about my faith by “doing it” rather than just “thinking about it”. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Blessings!
Semantics. Torah is not ethnically Jewish. It is a revelation of God’s character given to the Jews first, but that does not make it Jewish ethnically. I say this to assure non-Jewish (ethnic) that following Torah is not going to somehow make them Jews. I have no disagreement with Paul. He just approaches the problem for a different angle.
Be careful about Paul’s argument concerning circumcision. He argues it is not necessary FOR SALVATION. He does not argue that it has no place at all.
The Torah pre-dates Abraham because it is the eternal revelation of the character of God. The major tenants of Torah can be found in Genesis. It isn’t necessary to wait until Exodus to see it. Just clearer.
I am proud to hear that you have taken a distinctively different which has facilitated numerous conversations. However, what you listed does include a lot of Jewish traditions, as I am sure you know, which are not specifically Torah based. Nevertheless, a great witness.
Skip, are all “Jews” Jewish? Perhaps you can help others better understand. You know, “….rightly dividing the Word of Truth.” I believe Saul of Tarsus said that. Robert can cite it better tho.
Not quite sure what you have in mind here. Of course, all ethnic Jews are Jewish if you mean of the genetic bloodline. But even bloodline Jews are not all Jewish if you mean those who follow the commandments of the Jewish God YHWH. And Paul clearly argued that those who are accepted by YHWH are “Jews” in the sense that they are grafted into Israel as YHWH’s Kingdom even if they are Gentiles by bloodline, but that does not and never could make the Jews by blood. Furthermore, Paul opposes those of bloodline who required Gentiles to convert to Judaism and become “Jews.” So, it is again apparent that CONTEXT determines the meaning of the word.
As for the Greek term used in the NT, usually translated “Jews,” it is technically the word for those of the tribe of Judah but by the time of the first century it was commonly understood to refer to all who were of the bloodline of Abraham.
Sorry Skip. Not the same conlusion i came to.
I have to say this raises more questions than it answers for me, which is probably a good thing. For instance a number of the 613 Torah commands would be about the day to day governing of Israel at that time. For a better word the ‘civil laws’ or justice system. How do those apply today even if you are a Jew living in Israel because the Israeli Govt and Nation has its own Judicial system, which believers would have an obligation and responsibility to live by which are far removed from the Torah commands on civil law. So I guess those Torah commands would be non valid just the same as you said there is no temple so the temple commands cannot or would not apply. Am I assuming right here.
The modern government of Israel is not Torah observant, sorry to say. But no modern government is. However, your comment that if we lived in the land we would have to obey (apply) the laws of the land makes me think that perhaps you are alluding to Paul’s supposed comment about government authorities. If that is true, then please, please read Mark Nanos on Romans. I have written about this sometime ago.
Living in Israel today makes some of the 613 easier to keep. Others not so much. The influence of Hellenism and Babylon is everywhere, isn’t it?
We wait for the Millennial Kingdom when Torah will finally be the constitution of the whole earth.
Skip,
Thanks for a terrific post on one of the foundational issues of being a follower of Messiah. I also want to thank your readers for the many insightful comments ahead of me. This is great stuff for newbies struggling with questions as they are being called out of orthodoxy.
My wife and I fellowship with the Messianics. We love it! We love the open discussions. We love keeping the Festivals. We love the weekly Torah teaching and discussion. That being said, naturally there are many thorny and difficult issues too. There is the debate over the “Two Houses”. There is the debate over how much “Judaism” we should embrace. It is my opinion that some Messianic groups especially congregations that are led by former Jews, are often overly embracing of Talmudic traditions. Some are way too supportive of the state of Israel as if that is the righteous thing to do. Some evangelical groups fall into that same error. In a remarkable and clear cut statement to the Jewish community of His day, just before his crucufixion (set up by Jews!), He told them recorded in Matthew chapter 21: “Therefore, I tell you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people producing the fruits of it.” (Matt 21:43) NRSV
That is a hard saying. But it shows that the Jews were temporarily dismissed because they failed to produce the fruit God is always looking for from everyone and that is RIGHTEOUSNESS. And the Word teaches us that keeping Torah is righteousness! Now, the “called out ones” are the only ones of all the followers of Messiah in the multitude of Christian religious belief systems out there who accept Torah as having authority over theri lives. Yahshua said: “You shall know them by their fruits”. This is the group being prepared by Yahshua to rule with Him in his upcoming Kingdom. This is why the Messianic movement is growing by leaps and bounds. This is why God is raising up gifted teachers such as Skip to lead His called out ones into true righteousness by pointing them to Torah.
Getting back to Judaism, for a moment, we all know that the Jews had the Romans murder Yahshua, though Pilate found no guilt in Him! Then in 70 AD, after giving the Jews 40 years to repent, God judged them and had the Romans destroy their Temple. What irony. After that, the Jews were mostly scattered around the world till they started to return to the land in the late 19th century. To this day, they have not repented in mass and returned to Torah. To this day, their rabbinical leaders proudly hold their Talmudic traditions and wisdom of the rabbis in a higher position than Torah. It is not surprising that the Catholic church does the same exact thing – they elevate the “traditions of the fathers” higher in value than the Scriptures. The patterns of Satanic deceptions are not too difficult to discern.
The Book of Acts in particular documents for us great persecution of the new evolving church by the Jews. As prophesied, the followers of Messiah were driven out of the synagogues. Many were put to death! Ironically, the Jews themselves were being hammered by the Romans, so it was a dangerous time to be a Jew. These two conditions pushed the fledging followers of Messiah away for such things as keeping Shabbat and to worshipping on Sundays. This was tragic but its our church history. The late Adventist historian, Dr Samuele Bacchiocchi has done an excellent job of documenting this in his book: “From Sabbath to Sunday”. It’s a dry read but well worth it!
Driven away from its Hebraic roots, the Church fell under the influence of Hellenistic culture and beliefs and we have this mess with us to this day. I so appreciate the contribution that Skip is making in bringing it to people’s attention around the world. No doubt about it – it is Yah’s doing. Hallelujah!
I pray that readers will not find my comments anti-Semetic. God has kept a remnant of Jews faithful to Torah so that they will be in the “first fruit” resurrection. Paul tells us in Romans chapters 9,10 and 11 that ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED! But Paul also teaches that everyone will be saved in their own time – see 1Corinthians chapter 15 for that story.
John Walsh
John, All you have said it was God has shown me when he opened my heart to the truth of Messiah Yeshua thirty-three weeks ago. I continue to wake up, ask God to give me his path for me today, and he brings me to the truths and mysteries of scripture in Torah, God’ Word, Laws of his Kingdom and worthy children. Today September 18, 2014, God has brought me to a group where I can come to, pay attention, discern, seek truths, and pray, ponder, and have God reassure his truths. Thanks to you John, Skip, Emily, Robin, and all other posts that keep me ‘seeking the truths that will set me free’. Amen.
The Law (Torah,if you will) serves a purpose. If God says, “Thou shalt not” and then we turn around and do it- i.e., “eat the fruit” or do what God has instructed not to do- this is “sin.” Sin is disobedience to the instructions (law) of God. The ten words or ten commandments have been broken, literally all ten of them. Where does this leave us (all)? Guilty before the thrice-holy God, and every bit as guilty as our original mom and dad. Please, step forward, someone- and say to us all- “I” have never transgressed the Law (Torah).
The (original) purpose of the Law and the (remaining) purpose of God’s instructions (the Law) goes something like this: “Junior, don’t go play in traffic,- you’ll get hurt.” Or, Carl, don’t touch the stove, it’s hot”. But what does little Carl do? He disobeys the instructions (Torah/Law) of His Father, and places his hand on the hot stove- and of course, with what results? What are the wages of sin? Does our (willing) choice to sin carry any consequences? Has no one ever been “burned” before?
The wages of sin is death. Death in its simplest form (and I do confess to being a simple man) is separation. Sin separates us (sinners are us) from God who is thrice-holy. ~ But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear ~ (Isaiah 59.2) Simply put, “sin separates.” Sin separates man from God and sin separates between man and man. Sin divides. Man is a sinner ( I really don’t care at this point how he got here- it is a stated fact- “all” have sinned) It doesn’t matter our ancestral background or economic status, or possessions, or position- universally and in every culture – man, generically and specifically has sinned. We (only those who now draw breath) are sinners. Sinners are us. Houston, we (all) have a problem.
If the current count is correct, there are 613 rules to keep. 613 rules to live by. 613 rules to please YHWH. How many among us may say, I have never sinned? and I have kept to the letter,- all 613? I’ll wait while you decide..
What is, and what remains the “purpose” of the Law? The Law was (and remains) our SchoolMaster to lead us to Christ. Does God know, or is He ignorant of our need of something? If, (more like “since”) we are sinners (all, as we may recall)- then (some dumb guy inquired) are we (all) and do we (all) now stand in serious need of a Savior? The purpose of the Law? Shall we hear the words of God? ~ ~ But we know that whatever things The Written Law has said, it has said to those who are into The Written Law, that every mouth may be shut and the whole universe may be guilty before God.. ~ (Romans 3.19) ~ For the commandment is a lamp and the teaching a light, and the reproofs of discipline are the way of life..~ (Proverbs 6.23) ~ The unfolding of your words gives light; it gives understanding to the simple ~ (Psalm 119.130)
There is nothing at all “wrong” with the instructions of our Father. The Law of the LORD is perfect. Light is that which reveals. What does God’s Law (the Light) reveal?
As the dentist peers into your open mouth, behind him is a bright light, “revealing”- the rot and decay inside your head. There is nothing wrong with the light- it is quite necessary to accomplish the task at hand- assisting the dentist in his duties. Now that the sin and rot and decay has been revealed- what can be done about it? The problem (most assuredly) is sin, but what is the solution? ~ What must I (or any man) “do” to be saved? Or, if we are still stuck, do we (both Jew and Gentile) even “need” to be saved?
I’m willing to ask, is salvation necessary? Or have we become “comfortable” living with sin? Just what does our thrice-holy God expect from us? And are any among us, “good enough?”
This is probably where the “rubber meets the road.” Am I good enough? ~what do the scriptures say? ~ You, (sir or m’am) ~ have been weighed in the balances, and found wanting ~ (may I quickly add, so have I!) Why is this? Because God only demands and expects sinless perfection. If sin separates, “how much sin” would separate us from Him? Only one. Please read and understand- it is not the “amount” of sin, – it the “fact” of sin. Well.. I’m not as “bad” as he, or she.. Oh? By what standard are we measuring ourselves? A sinner comparing himself (or herself) with another sinner? Isn’t that hilarious? I’m longer than the drunkard in the gutter? I’m a better man than he or she- but am I “good enough?” The short answer? “No.” “Good enough” -never is. What is the solution then, for sin? Try harder? Better luck next time? More striving? More seeking? More “do?” Be (as my English teacher used to say) -“more gooder?”
~How then can man be justified with God? or how can he be clean that is born of a woman? ~ (Job 25:4) Great question Job.. ~ Whom God has set forth to be a propitiation (a peace offering) through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; with a view to demonstrating, at the present time, His righteousness, that He may be shown to be righteous Himself, and the Giver of righteousness to those who believe in Jesus (who is the) Christ ~
(Romans 3.25,26)
Who (he inquired) is the Just One? Who (he inquired) is the Righteous One? And who (he inquired) offered Himself upon the execution stake, (the tslav) as a substitutionary Sacrifice, and by His blood has made peace between God (who is holy) and man (who is sinful)?
Has Christ died in vain and for nought? Interesting. Not only is He ~ despised and rejected by men ~ but now, it seems -Now that we have returned to “how wrong the church has been” and how right the Torah is- He is the forgotten Christ. Who needs the cross anyway? We have the Torah! (or so it seems..) Rules for righteous living! Yes, I agree.. Keep every one of them ~ For the person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws ~ (James 2.10) Huh? If all I did my whole life long was to “break” or not keep one commandment- I would be still be guilty before God? I don’t think we recognize or realize just “how holy” God is! He demands perfection. Are there any perfect people among us? Or are you a sinner,such as myself? Once again.. we would ask- “is the cross of Christ who is the Anointed One and the Incarnation of the Logos necessary?
~The message of the crucifixion is foolishness/nonsense/insanity to the lost, but to those of us who have life it is the power of God ~ (1 Corinthians 1.18) Friends, it is not about “how wrong” the Torah (and the keeping of the Torah) is – it is about how right our kneeling before tHis cross is.. ~ Believe on the LORD Jesus Christ- and you (sir or m’am) will be saved/delivered/healed/forgiven/born from above. ~
What part does the cross of Christ, the tslav, the execution stake have to play in our (common) salvation? Any part at all? Or was this just an addendum or afterthought? The “end” of the one called the Christ? (lol!- you just can’t keep a Good Man down!) ~ Away with Him!- let Him be crucified! ~ We will not have this Man to reign over us~ His blood be upon us and on our children! ~ Release unto us -Barabbus! Who, dear friends was guilty before God on that day? Every single one of us who called for His execution. And what, after hours of cruel mocking, beatings and bloody torture was His response? Did He give unto us what we fully deserved? No. Not at all. His words were these: ~ Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do. ~ What, (he inquired) was the need of that day? ~ My God will supply all your needs according to His riches in glory by Christ Jesus ~ and did we, (do we) ever stand in need of forgiveness? All because of Calvary.
What is the gospel of Christ? What is the “good news” concerning The Messiah? It is this: ~ Christ died for sinners, of whom I am chief ~ Ask, and you will receive ~ God be merciful to me, a sinner ~
I will arise and go to my Father, and I will say to Him, “Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you. “Now I am not worthy to be called your son. Make me as one of your hired servants.” And he arose and came to his Father. But while he was still a long way off, his Father saw him and felt compassion, and ran and embraced him and kissed him. His son said to him, ‘Father, I have sinned against both heaven and you, and I am no longer worthy of being called your son.’ But the Father said to his servants, ‘Bring quickly the best robe, and put it on him, and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet. Bring the fattened calf and kill it. Let’s have a feast and celebrate. for this son of mine was dead and has now returned to life. He was lost, but now he is found.’ So the party began ~
Rereading this article.. we have a question…
you wrote~
In fact, some commands of Torah don’t apply to Gentiles at all because Gentiles are not Jews.
Could you explain this statement? What are we when we are “Grafted-In”? Aren’t “JEWS” actually
just the tribe of Judah? Aren’t there 12 tribes?
Help! Unlearning, Relearning, & LEARNING!!!
Praise YAH!
Your sister on the mountain~
Chari 🙂
Jews are not all from the tribe of Judah, and I will never be a Levite, so the commandments for Levites will never apply to me. Etc.
Okay…
but what about the “GENTILES”?
what are we when we are “Grafted In”?
Not gentiles anymore, right?
We are Israel, right? We are Hebrew, right?
Gentiles~ the nations, the goyim, the other guys
NOT following YHWH, right?
Still trying to “get” this!
Thanks!
Hi Michael & Chari,
Doesn’t “grafted in” sort of conjure up a vision of a new gentile branch on the Tree of Life?
Or the Olive Tree in Homer’s Odyssey, outside in the patio of Penelope and Odysseus?
Maybe a more logical metaphor, but less aesthetically pleasing, would be a computer program
A computer program can be thought of as a logical “tree structure” in a programming language
Only the “tree” is upside down and a “Master Module” controls the seven lower modules (tribes)
We can think of the addition of the 8th module as the “grafted” gentile tribe