Exegetical Choices
And for this reason hath he been chosen and hidden before Him, before the creation of the world and for evermore. 1 Enoch 48:6
Before the creation – Most Christians have never heard of the Book of Enoch. Written about 300 BCE, it is a part of Jewish apocalyptic literature. Some of it is actually quoted in the canonical New Testament book of Jude (Jude 1:14-15). It is still considered canonical by the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and the Eritrean Orthodox Tewahedo Church and during the time of Yeshua it would certainly have been recognized as part of the body of Jewish literature. What makes this particularly important for our examination of the idea of Yeshua’s sacrifice before the foundation of the world are the statements in Enoch 48.
And at that hour that Son of Man was named In the presence of the Lord of Spirits, and his name before the Head of Days. (1 Enoch 48:2)
All who dwell on earth shall fall down and worship before him, and will praise and bless and celebrate with song the Lord of Spirits. And for this reason hath he been chosen and hidden before Him, before the creation of the world and for evermore. (1 Enoch 48:5-6)[1]
These texts support the claim that the “Son of Man,” a term of divinity, not humanity,[2] pre-exists the formation of the world and is worthy of worship as divine. The common phraseology applied to Yeshua by Christians is found in this Jewish literature. Verse 3 calls the “Son of Man” a “light of the Gentiles” or “the light of the nations.” If the Son of Man in 1 Enoch is worthy of worship and a light to the nations, then he has obviously fulfilled the requirements that allow the Gentiles to approach YHWH in worship and he is himself divine. Remember that these are Jewish texts, written at least 200 years before Yeshua was born. Clearly some factions of Judaism were looking for the kind of Messiah that Yeshua claimed to be. It is a very short step from this literature to claim that the sacrificial work of the Messiah also occurred before the foundation of the world. The texts of John’s apocalyptic and Peter’s letter fit easily into the literature of the much earlier 1 Enoch.
This gives us further evidence that the statements in Revelation and 1 Peter are consistent with Jewish understanding of the pre-existent role of the Messiah. When John, Peter and the author of Hebrews add the fact that in his pre-existent role Yeshua entered the heavenly Temple to perform the sacrifice needed for the forgiveness of sin as a priest of the order of Melchizedek, they are not saying anything that would have been unrecognizable to a Jewish audience. But to suggest that the sin sacrifice occurred on the cross doesn’t fit any Jewish understanding of this sacrifice. Once again we are confronted with an exegetical choice. We either claim that what these men said makes sense within the context of their own reading audience, or we claim that they introduce completely novel and unconscionable thoughts to Jews. Given the undisputed fact that nearly all believers in Yeshua as the Messiah for the first ten years after the crucifixion were Jewish, which makes more sense?
Topical Index: 1 Enoch 48:6, before the foundation, cross, sacrifice
That does make sense. The excerpt from Enoch refers to
Head of Days, Son of Man, and Lord of Spirits. That sounds
like Father, Son, and Holy Spirit to me.
I’m intrigued. How did this take place since Jesus is both the High Priest and the Sacrifice.
i have such a fascination with words. can’t imagine where that came from. your topic reminded me of this word:
Word of the Day for Tuesday, February 5, 2013
epexegesis ep-ek-si-JEE-sis, noun:
1. the addition of a word or words to explain a preceding word or sentence.
2. the word or words so added.
But you did establish personal contact? In epexegesis or on a point of order?
— James Joyce, Finnegan’s Wake
One of the most striking peculiarities of colloquial speech in Dutch, and of natural free talk in general, is what is called epexegesis.
— Jan Gonda, Selected Studies
Epexegesis, a late Renaissance word, is derived from the Greek epexḗgēsis meaning explanation.
Thank you Abba! GREAT BIG HUG!!!
moi
I never plan anything. I just “randomly” do. I do “whatever” and “whenever”.. everything depends upon a whim or flight of fancy. There is no forethought, and certainly no foreknowlege and why should I plan anything, ever at all? Preparation for a journey? Take any thought to prepare before leaving town for the weekend? No.. never. Why should I?
We (all) (according to the scriptures) now have the mind of Christ. God never plans anything either.. or does He? ~ In the beginning was the LOGOS. Word. Thought. Idea. As we (all) are made in the image of God and as we (all) are to love the LORD our God with (all) our heart-soul-mind-(mind?)-and strength, were we not in the mind of God before the actual events of Goliath or Ester or Ruth or the provision God made (a substitutionary Lamb) in place of Isaac or the first Passover, which resulted in the release of God’s chosen ones from the bondage of Pharaoh or the crucifixion of the Son of man (and Son of God)
when? and where? and how? “All” prophesied in the scriptures thousands of years before and previous to the actual event (the crucifixion of Christ at Calvary) took place. “Was” this the Messiah is not the correct question here. “Is” this the Chosen One? and why did He die? Yes, inquiring minds (like me) want to know. “Let my people think.”
And if you “think” for a moment, I “do” before I “think about my doing” may I promise to “whoever” you are dead wrong. My trips to the gym require planning on my part. The work I do during the day requires planning on my part. Planning a budget to pay the bills requires planning on my part. I (shudder!) have a brain, and (sometimes) I think thoughts. What? ~ bringing into captivity every (what?)- bringing into captivity every (Jewish or Gentile?) thought to the obedience of Christ ~ My thought life? What was I thinking? (or was I “even” thinking?)
My beloved daughter when she was of a tender age, “thought” it might be fun to jump off the front porch while wearing her roller skates. In the mind of a child, she “thought” (apparently) she could do it. I “believe” I can fly!). Of course, my question to her after she came home from the hospital with a broken arm.. “why did you do it?” Daddy.. I thought I could.. I (mistakingly) “believed”..
You who think of sin but lightly,
Nor suppose the evil great,
Here may view its nature rightly,
Here its guilt may estimate.
Mark the Sacrifice appointed!
See Who bears the awful load!
’Tis the Word, the Lord’s Anointed,
Son of Man, and Son of God.
Our attitudes alter and affect our actions and our “beliefs” bias our behavior and “if” I “believe” I’ll have 72 black-eyed Virginians waiting for me in glory if I will destroy myself and take others with me, my “beliefs” (though thoroughly false they may be) most assuredly will affect my actions. – Our creeds (what we believe) are the criterion for our conduct and our doctrine determines our deeds. The devilish desire to destroy life is “exhibit A” of what a twisted and perverted mind can do. The “thief’s” purpose is to steal and kill and destroy…(John 10.10) – Don’t let him steal your joy! (But even the thief has a purpose!) And the plan of our adversary is? to steal and kill and destroy..
~ and they found him “sitting, clothed, and in his right mind” ~ (Luke 8.35)
(from Charles Haddon Spurgeon)
Of all the stories of the NT, that of “the wild man of Gadara” is perhaps the greatest blessing to me. On a personal level, it reminds me where I was, and would be, without the Lord Jesus Christ; on levels metaphorical, ethical, and spiritual, what a portrait the story paints of the helpless, lost sinner dwelling in the cemetery of spiritual death, tormented by Satan, wild with unchained passions and unfettered licentiousness. All men are not as wicked as they could be, but all men without Christ are wicked, all dwelling in the catacombs of depravity, all with their own demonic tormentors, all rattling the broken chains and fetters of fallen conscience and moral unrestraint, and all running, crying, and cutting themselves with unconscious but, nonetheless, inevitably suicidal behavior.
But then came Jesus.
De-boarding the ship, Jesus beheld the Gadarene demoniac, the wild man who ran to Him and worshiped Him. By His omnipotent command, the Lord Jesus Christ tamed a hellish heart, so that the tortured sinner, dwelling in tombs, mutilating himself and destroying his life, a man no other man could bind, was now under the sovereign sway of the Son of God “sitting, clothed, and in his right mind.”
“Sitting” denotes a radical change of posture, from raucous aimlessness to to placid composure, from pandemonium to Peace.
“Clothed” denotes the civilization of the passions, unashamed nakedness supplanted by sanctified conscience manifested by ethical demeanor and decorum.
“In his right mind” infers mental metamorphosis, the intellect and will now being respectively enlightened and liberated unto Truth and Righteousness.
Thanks be to our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, whose power to save is such that even a wild man, bent on destroying himself, now sits at the Master’s feet, “sitting, clothed, and in his right mind.”
And this testimony in song -from another “redeemed one”
Like a babe when it cries
For its His mother
Like a child I was helpless, alone.
Then, I met the Master.
Now, I am one of His own.
For all things were changed
When He found me.
And a new day broke through
All around me.
For, then, I met the Master.
Now, I belong to Him.
Like a blind man who walks in the darkness,
I had longed, I had searched for the Light.
Then, I met the Master
Now, I walk no more in the night.
~ For you are all children of light and children of the day and you are not children of the night, neither children of darkness ~ (1 Thessalonians 5.5)
~ and if we walk in the light as He is in the light.. we (then) have fellowship with one another.. ~
Hi Jeanette,
I don’t know you except from my reading of your comments each day here on Skip’s TW blog. You seem like a fun, carefree person and a person who knows and loves the Lord.
I do not want to be in the role of the TW blog police and have avoided making any comments for a long time, however, I felt like someone needed to say something to you. I have prayed about what to say and what not to say. I was hoping someone else would speak up, but I guess the task falls to me today.
I wonder at times if you realize how your comments come across to the others who read this blog and occasionally write something, as myself. Honestly, I am surprised you are not embarrassed by your comments. It seems much of the time you admit that you haven’t even read the TW. And your comments almost never have anything to do with the daily TW. Most of your comments are very flippant and non sequitur.
Maybe you need to checkout Facebook. Your comments would actually be very appropriate for that website. I am just asking for you to consider my words and then pray about it.
Thanks and Shalom…
Hi Gary! i am so pleased to meet you! Not to worry. i do not fear any police. But, i do as I am led by the Sweet and Holy Spirit after dedicating the words of my mouth, the meditations of my heart and the use of my fingers – through prayer and supplication. Do you do that?
Shalom
His Handmaiden
p.s. one day i will share some characteristics of Our Father that you may have overlooked as you search scripture. It was a while before I found them too! 🙂
Hi Jeanette:)
I cringe to read these few entries though I understand the need to limit the scope of dialogue here. I want you to know that I have enjoyed very much the levity you bring and hope you remain a voice that can be heard here. Ultimately, I’m inclined to believe that we all have a responsibility to limit ourselves to that which is edifying to the whole. I pray that His Spirit prevail in us all.
Blessings:)
Amein!
Shalom
Jeanette.
African internet is very slow so I have been off for a few days. However, now that I am catching up, I see that your comment is not appropriate to MY blog site. I am removing it. Please make some attempt to consider what you say before you say it.
Thanks Skip.
Wow! 1052 words. This is loooooooooooong.
Forgive me, I am trying to understand what you are implying. To say that the sin sacrifice did not happen “on the cross” seems to reject numerous passages of Scripture that say exactly that. Is. 53; 1 Cor. 15:3; Matt. 20:28; Heb 7:27; 1 Pet. 2:24, just to name a few. Did the sin sacrifice occur “before the foundation of the world”? I believe it did. I also believe it was manifested “as in heaven so on earth.” The concept of atonement/redemption/goel is YHVH’s and therefore without beginning or end and YHVH brings forth all thing in the fullness of time – HIS. If the understanding you seem to be putting forth – sin sacrifice already done, so the cross must represent something else – then why do we have so many direct words about the death of Yeshua as a sacrifice for sin? I do understand that Yeshua’s coming and subsequent death and resurrection was multifaceted, but this is the particular piece that is being discussed here. It is also important to note that along with Gentile thinking, “Jewish” thinking can be myopic, seeing only what fits their paradigm at the time. Thanks for any insight.
I don’t think you were participating in this community when Skip wrote this. Perhaps this will help you understand more where he’s coming from.
https://skipmoen.com/2012/08/25/rewriting-history/
Another example of “as in heaven so on earth” would be the tabernacle and the temple, both representations of what already existed in heaven. Copies, I believe it is translated. For what reason? So we could get a glimpse of glory? To establish the reality of the Spiritual in a way we can comprehend? To know we have a God who cares enough that the tiniest detail is not left to our vain imaginations? All of the above, me thinks.
If the sacrificial lamb was slain before the foundation of the world, and He bled in the eternal realm with divine blood, when He said to Jeremiah ” before I formed you I knew you, was a reference to Jesus intimately knowing Jeremiah before the foundations of the world. I was wondering if God knew Jeremiah, what was the reason He did not know the ones that said “we healed people in your name we cleansed the lepers, we raised the dead” and Jesus said to them “I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity” So we must have had choices before the foundation of the world, maybe he chose us based on our prior choices. Since intimacy is a choice, and yet He chose us before the world began. The cross tore the heavens open and we are to follow Him up through the opening He made for us, we are to be filled with the power of the same spirit that raised Jesus from the dead and follow him through the sufferings of the cross so we too can learn obedience and then remember what the Father commanded Him, that he who descends must also ascend! We are to continue the journey and become one with Him. We see that Jesus was now the Bridegroom King! This was a progression from sonship. He could not stay with Mary Magdalene because He had not yet gone to be glorified by His Father. I have a feeling Mary didn’t have to wait very long before He came back for her. If we existed in Christ before the foundation of the world, the Father declared it was not good for man to be alone”, so He “formed” a type of Eve for His Son Jesus- the she part was taken out of His rib… As the Father prepared Jesus for the Bride, The Father also has a daughter to prepare for His son the KING of the Jews, the KING of KINGS! And so all things are for the wedding feast of the Lamb! For the prize set before Him (His Bride) He endured, and it is for those who love Him to set Him always before us and endure the Holy preparations and be clothed in the garments and have our lamps filled be watching and listening for the trumpet sound, behold He comes quickly. The Spirit and the Bride say come LOrd Jesus!
I found this website, which might offer some helpful info:
http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/faq/slainfounda.html
Thank you, Judi. This is very helpful.
Hi Warren! i have a cousin with the same name!
As-salamu alaykum,
MFSB