Theoretical Community (1)
Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. Romans 8:1 NASB
No condemnation – Is Paul speaking the truth? If you’re part of the assembly of followers of Yeshua HaMashiach, are you free from condemnation? Oh, I understand the theory! But this hasn’t been my experience! Perhaps you are blessed to belong to a fellowship where katakrima has disappeared. Please, tell me where that is! Otherwise I am likely to think that Paul was talking about some sort of spiritual reality that doesn’t actually appear on this earth until the last day.
Paul is quite forceful about this. The Greek is ouden ara nun katakrima (literally: “Nothing therefore now condemnation,” or “Not a single thing now condemns”). This is the character of those in the Messiah Yeshua. Katakrima is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew mishpat, “to judge, to rule” with both a legal and moral sense. But mishpat became associated with grace and mercy. One who should experience mishpat is counted righteous and forgiven, his debt cancelled. On the coming Day of Judgment, this person will be decreed accepted. God judges. That fact is undeniable in Jewish thought. But He also shows mercy. When Paul proclaims that those “in the Messiah” are not condemned, he might have the final day in mind, but when he adds nun (now) he must mean that as of this moment the issue has been settled. Those in the fellowship of the Messiah are not now condemned. On the Day of Judgment, they will be accepted, but today, on this day, they are also accepted.
It’s a great theory. When we all stand before the Judgment Seat of the Most High, it will work. But what about right now? Does judgment still have a voice? Do you find that you can be completely transparent? Do you see others welcoming each other as they really are? Do you even know the trials, burdens, blessings, victories and failures of those who worship with you?
I recently conducted a session with a business team. These people had been working together for five years. In ten minutes I found out more about their individual passions, work attitudes and hopes than they knew about each other after five years. The secret: I just asked the right questions. I asked what really made them excited about living. But I had to ask! Otherwise they would continue to come to work, isolated, disconnected, just doing the job and living for something else. I wonder how many of our “fellowship assemblies” are just the same. We don’t ask because we are afraid about our own possible condemnation. We have “secret” sins that whisper, “If they only knew, they wouldn’t love me.” Paul’s theory works with God. It works on the last day when all the secrets come out. But until it works now, this day, we aren’t really in the Messiah, are we? We are still just living like everyone else—afraid, hidden, condemned.
I wonder who will be brave enough to ask. We’ll find out—tomorrow.
Topical Index: katakrima, mishpat, judge, condemn, Romans 8:1
I guess I just have never understood why some translations do not add the rest of the sentence for this verse, because I have never seen anything but confusion result from leaving it out. I will now do a Paul Harvey impersonation: “and now – for the REST of the story”. The KJV, which I prefer (even though it has its slants, too), reads “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” I have seen this verse, in the translations that cut off the ending, most often used to ‘justify’ continuing to sin as being acceptable: just claim Jesus as your saviour and you’re good to go. They want to ignore the fact that Paul is making – that this only works when you are NOT walking in the flesh – but I guess it is just as useful to correct a tendency to want to swing in the other direction, like Skip is saying, and continue to walk in condemnation now, too, which (like choosing to continue to walk in guilt instead of repenting) is the opposite of what Paul is trying to get people to do.
Salvation (because it includes sanctification too) is a present progressive condition. The wild beasts (that I am getting saved from) get driven out of the land little by little as I grow big enough to be able to keep up the land. I have to learn HOW to “walk in the Spirit”. Even though the promise of the Spirit is given in its entirety, I still have to appropriate it. To do that, I have to cease to “walk… (in) the flesh”. Its a trade. I cannot do both at the same time in the same place. The Spirit brings that “no condemnation” condition with Him – for in heaven, my status has already been established – but the flesh can give no such assurance.
This verse has taught me that if I am feeling condemned, I need to check my flesh status. And be prepared to switch over to the other tank (repent) immediately. It teaches me that condemnation (which would be emanating from that reliable schoolmaster, the Law), to a believer, has exactly one useful purpose, and that is to show me where I am still walking in the flesh. Condemnation is a sure indication that there are still some wild beasts in my neighborhood that I need saving from. Immediately.
There are those scholars who support the idea that the second part of the phrase in the first verse did not appear in the original and was the error of a scribe. Yes, I know that most of the codex supports it, BUT consider that all of the know documents were written well after the division between Judaism and Christianity and that there might well have been an inherent bias in those who recopied the original letter. The idea of a separation between flesh and spirit flies in the face of the Jewish understanding that man is not a divided being. Nephesh is the living being that is one whole being.
Let us read the second half of the verse as Laurita explained…
who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
And now read Matt 7: 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
It is strange how the Spirit of God works as I visit different in-doctrinal communities at different stages in my life and all add on to each other very few actually differ. The depths of understanding is the only difference I hear in the views shared.
Here is such and addition. These two scriptures say the same thing in two different ways… An I was reminded of about them by two different approaches; Christian and Messianic.
The truth is we must be in Christ – If Christ be the anointed we must be the anointed to be in Him. if Christ be the mystical saviour we must be in the teachings of the saviour to be the saviour for others…
In Matt 7 it is not about what we do or believe is the right thing to do it is about doing what God wants us to do… Gal 2:10.
So being in Christ is for me not about following a doctrine or sect it is about being in the works that YHVH has established… Yes this sounds as if upholding of the Torah is no salvation as that is what brings us in line to be called, doing Torah keeps us as far as humanly possible holy separated from the world / flesh / our personal goals / desires.
Now what I also heard today: The wrong theology kills… Listening to incorrect views concerning the scriptural records kills. It leads us into comfort zones: Just do the Torah, Just call on His name, Just believe in His name, Just be part of this or that doctrine or sect.
When in fact the truth is be the Christ and Saviour for others – Greater works will you do than I for I go to the Father… Sound familiar.
It is John 1: 1-14 and the word took on flesh by making no provision for the flesh…
In doing this there is no condemnation in making provision for the flesh there is condemnation.
It is not how many converts I make, Not how many sermons or missionaries I tackle… I must be the saviour for the one that crosses my path today… A neighbour for those robbed of their truth / possessions…
Think of mother Theresa: love and care only about the one now in your hands – this way the numbers make no difference but the difference we can make for one soul to be saved is what matters. No glory for us glory only unto God.
If you believe this comment may cause more harm than good remove it please from the blog…
Skip this is the second time lately that you have taken scripture out of context for a comment. You have warned us against exactly this kind of scriptural study. Thanks Laurita for adding the rest of the story. Tomorrows post will be interesting.
Thank you so much you guys in your replies to Skips commentaries. I have very little education and this stifles my freedom to reply in writing comment, but I must say I enjoy all your insights into the Word. I have been reading Skip commentaries for the past two months and I feel I am growing in leaps and bounds. I love Torah and could not think of anything else I’d rather do that study His word.
I just want you to know I’m in the back room drinking up all your words of wisdom and insite. Shalom
Questions and Answers
Ahh, Romans chapter eight! The zenith, the apex of the blessed book of Romans, and now for the introductory verse: [Let us “enter in..!”]
~ There is therefore now, no condemnation to those who are “in Christ Jesus..” [those] who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.. ~ (Romans 8.1)
And? .. if anyone does not have the Spirit of the Messiah, he does not belong to Him. (Romans 8.9)
And?.. The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God!.. (Romans 8.16)
It just gets better and better!!
But wait! There’s more.. (So much more..!)
Yes, it is certainly true, to get the right answers, we must ask the right questions!! Yes, and amen. My friends, Paul (himself) asks the question and I’ll join with him in asking also.. “Who is he who condemns?” or We might ask.. (go ahead- do it!” Who is the One who judges? God and God alone is the onliest (?) One who judges or condemns — Who am I to judge my brother?- Nope,nope.. I ain’t gonna do it . God and God alone is the (onliest) righteous Judge!
Yes, we all (only those who ever drew a God-given breath) will stand before Him on that day, and… we are standing before the One who judges the living and the dead RIGHT NOW!! – We don’t have to wait for Heaven (Heaven can wait?) for in Him (hello) we live and move and have our very being!!
Therefore, (’bout time for a therefore don’t you think? – lol!) Therefore, (that’s right, look and see for yourself what it’s there for!) There is NOW, (rat cheer, rat now) NO (zero, zip, nada, squat) NO condemnation to those who (what?) ONLY to those who are “IN” Christ Jesus. Are you in? Are YOU part of the “in’ crowd? Are you (right here, right now) “saved?” Have YOU been “born from Above?” Do you belong (lock-stock-and barrel, btw) to Him? Do you KNOW this? I am His and He is mine?
Yes, are you right now, right at this moment, in a serious “relationship” with the LORD Jesus (who is the) Christ? Are you a Messianic Jew? (don’t you just love these “titles” we give each other?
Friend, (whoever you are) there are only (rather narrow speech isn’t it?) Only those who are “in” or “out.”
It’s not about “religion” or “race!” It is matter of the heart. It is relationship!!
Do these words ring true in the center of your soul? Does the Spirit of the living God add His holy “amen” to these words? “Now I belong to Jesus, – Jesus belongs to me! Not for the years of time alone, but for eternity!! — Hallelujah! What a Savior, who can take a poor lost sinner, lift Him from the miry clay and set Him free!! I will ever tell the Story, shouting Glory! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Jesus ransomed me!!
Yes “Who” my friend, IS our Near-Kinsman Redeemer? Who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto Himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works? And “Who, my friend, [now] ever lives to make intercession for us?”
And the answer is? It is the LORD.
Beautiful Carl!! I haven’t posted before, but I’ve been reading some of the past TWs’. And I have listened to some of your talks on community, Skip. I can’t quite reconcile your views on capital punishment and refugee problem with God’s words and especially with those of Yeshua. Of course I am not a scholar. That means I can’t debate with you on that level. But as someone else said, one should not be intimidated by that sort of thing. ?
Hello Skip and “theoretical community,”
Please don’t take offense at my choice of words in quotes to refer to you. Without naming my secret sins specifically, I have come close in admitting I have them in previously made comments. No one at the church we attend knows of them, and I of course don’t know of those shared in the congregants. I am the piano player not the pastor. Skip, you are right on in inferring it is fear of being found out, exposed, that keeps us collectively quiet. I am reading a novel at present where public confession of sin is encouraged. The author puts more emphasis on the reaction of others immediately following the stated confession.
Moreover, I appreciate Laurita, Suzanne, and Seeker’s comments preceding mine. Being “In Messiah Yeshua” presents for me a word picture of being safely kept in a shelter that will work to ensure all dwellers will be kept safe til the end. Thanks, and I do look forward to tomorrow and future reflections!
Shalom to all of you,
David R
Those whom YHWH love, will be chastened but will not be condemned with those who are of the world / worldly, having the carnal mind which is an enemy to God.
We have been imputed with righteousness through our faith/ trust in YHWH, and are also sanctified / set-apart to walk in His ways /Torah, and are grafted into Israel, need have no fear of condemnation, WHEN we have returned to His ways, no more to walk in carnality. Amein! HalleluYAH!
BUT, “Do you find that you can be completely transparent?” NO!
“Do you see others welcoming each other as they really are?” NO!
“Do you even know the trials, burdens, blessings, victories and failures of those who worship with you?” NO! NOT in a theoretical community!
But, when it is YES, to the above, it is joyful where true bonding and Family relationship meant, where care and concern is REAL.